Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 29, 2022 17:13:24 GMT
Back this exchange; I said "Excavators uncovered the corpses which were collected by Sonderkommandos." You replied "You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies"
I have just quoted them both saying excavator.
Now, be honest, what did Weirnik and Rajchman actually say? Was it dragline as you claim, yes or no?No further discussing will be entertained until you answer that question.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Sept 29, 2022 19:34:37 GMT
Nessie wrote: Jeezus H, but how many times do you have to be told? I quoted Wiernik as calling the dragline a "machine" and an "excavator". I use the proper name, "dragline" for the M&H "machine" that Wiernik calls it. I don't recall what Rajchman called the dragline but judging from his past performance I would imagine it to be something as asinine as Wiernik's "machine/excavator". Germans called a dragline a "seilbagger" or just a "bagger". The poles called it a "koparka" and some other unpronounceable term. Wiernik and Rajchman were ignorant of all of those terms. How many times must you be told that?
Edit. Nessie is trying to hide the fact that he lied about the dragline being used to exhume the cadavers from the alleged graves. He claimed that the dragline only uncovered the graves but the sonderkommandos were the one's who actually exhumed the cadavers. He lied and got called on it and is now trying to cover that up. He also tried to claim that there were witnesses who corroborated Gley's description of how the cremation grate was constructed and how the Germans used only cadavers as fuel for the supposed cremations. Another lie from Nessie.
Then we have his lie of omission with his claim that academics support the conventional narrative of the holyhoax without ever mentioning that there are numerous qualified academics who dispute the conventional narrative of the Jews. Nessie got called on that lie, too, and is now trying to cover his lies up with his quibble over the Jew's ignorance of the correct name for a dragline. Nessie's sly lies don't fly.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 7:38:05 GMT
Nessie wrote: Jeezus H, but how many times do you have to be told? I quoted Wiernik as calling the dragline a "machine" and an "excavator". I use the proper name, "dragline" for the M&H "machine" that Wiernik calls it. I don't recall what Rajchman called the dragline but judging from his past performance I would imagine it to be something as asinine as Wiernik's "machine/excavator". Germans called a dragline a "seilbagger" or just a "bagger". The poles called it a "koparka" and some other unpronounceable term. Wiernik and Rajchman were ignorant of all of those terms. How many times must you be told that? ... There is no evidence a dragline and specifically the M&H dragline was used to excavate the graves and exhume the bodies. It has been assumed. From what I can find the most common type of excavator was the steam, or diesel powered shovel and there were various German manufacturers, such as Demag, Menck and Orenstein & Koppel. You have already admitted the Germans could have excavated large pits at TII, your only objection is the way the witnesses described how it was done. Your argument that an excavator cannot dig a pit as described does not work, so you lied and changed that to dragline. Will you now argue that a shovel excavator cannot dig pits as described? That means you are now arguing no excavator could dig large pits. Back this exchange; I said "Excavators uncovered the corpses which were collected by Sonderkommandos." You replied "You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies" I have just quoted them both saying excavator. Now, be honest, what did Weirnik and Rajchman actually say? Was it dragline as you claim, yes or no?
No further discussing will be entertained until you answer that question.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 7:39:36 GMT
If you want further discussion with me, you must answer yes or no;
What did Weirnik and Rajchman actually say? Was it dragline as you claim, yes or no?
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Sept 30, 2022 11:17:55 GMT
Damn! I've been calling the M&H dragline a Monck (Monk?) and Hambrock for the past few posts and it's actually a Menck and Hambrock. Mea culpa. Interesting though, that Nessie took advantage of my mistake to claim that a Menck dragline was an alternative to what I had mistakenly been calling a Monk and Hambrock dragline. There's no shortage of photos of the M&H draglines supposedly digging the graves at Treblinka II. Holyhoax luminaries such as Arad and Colls specifically claim that the M&H (Menck and Hambrock) draglines were used to dig the graves. If Nessie has photos of those other draglines working at Treblinka then let's see them. Nessie goes for another of his sleazy sly lies. Yep, the Germans could have dug as big a hole in the ground as they wished using anything from an army of dwarfs up to whatever technology they were capable. However, the Germans couldn't have dug graves as described by the witnesses with an unaided M&H dragline equipped with a ~35 foot boom. Nessie attempts to use my "admission" that the Germans could excavate large holes to "prove" that I said that the unaided M&H dragline with a ~35 foot boom could both excavate and stockpile the ex from graves that were 12X30X50 meters is a lie. Nessie's specialty is the sly lie. Yes, a shovel can dig a pit. No, there were no shovels that could dig the pits described by the witnesses with no auxiliary equipment. Nessie's sly lies are flying thick and fast. (sigh) for the umpteenth time, I said: I think that Nessie is looking for an "out" from having to discuss the rest of his sly lies.
Edit. Go here for a blurb about a shovel.
A shovel isn't the same thing as a dragline.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 16:00:05 GMT
This thread is about lying. So, again, back this exchange;
I said "Excavators uncovered the corpses which were collected by Sonderkommandos."
You replied "You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies"
I have quoted them both saying excavator.
Now, be honest, what did Weirnik and Rajchman actually say? Was it dragline as you claim, yes or no?
No further discussing will be entertained until you answer that question. The reason why you do not want to answer is because you have admit I was not lying and it was you who was lying. Just accept I have caught you lying, admit it, say sorry and we can move on.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Sept 30, 2022 16:22:27 GMT
I've told you numerous times that I called the M&H dragline a dragline and Wiernik called it both a "machine" and an "excavator". You were lying about the dragline only being used to uncover the graves while the sonderkommandos performed the actual exhumations. Wiernik had in fact claimed that the dragline could lift up to 3,000 cadavers at a time. I quoted him saying that. The fact remains that a clamshell can't exhume whole bodies and Wiernik was lying about seeing that happen.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 16:26:42 GMT
I've told you numerous times that I called the M&H dragline a dragline and Wiernik called it both a "machine" and an "excavator". You were lying about the dragline only being used to uncover the graves while the sonderkommandos performed the actual exhumations. Wiernik had in fact claimed that the dragline could lift up to 3,000 cadavers at a time. I quoted him saying that. The fact remains that a clamshell can't exhume whole bodies and Wiernik was lying about seeing that happen. You are still ignoring this exchange.
I said "Excavators uncovered the corpses which were collected by Sonderkommandos."
You replied "You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies"
You accused me of lying and then you lied. Admit that and say sorry and we can move on to your next allegation I lied, which I can prove is not the case.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Sept 30, 2022 16:44:08 GMT
You were trying to weasel dodge the fact that a clamshell can't exhume whole bodies. Thus you were claiming that the dragline only uncovered the bodies while the sonderkommandos exhumed and carried them to the crematory grates. Yes, you did lie about the dragline being used to only uncover the cadavers and I quoted Wiernik to prove that.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 16:57:18 GMT
You were trying to weasel dodge the fact that a clamshell can't exhume whole bodies. I never said it could. Neither did the witnesses. I said "Excavators uncovered the corpses which were collected by Sonderkommandos." You replied "You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies" You know that is not true and they said excavator, not dragline, or clamshell. They said excavator. I did not lie, you did and you do not have the guts to accept you lied and apologise. Weirnik said; "He put a machine for exhuming the corpses into operation, an excavator which could dig up 3,000 corpses at one time. A fire grate made of railroad tracks was placed on concrete foundations 100 to 150 meters in length. The workers piled the corpses on the grate and set them on fire." He also said; "The hardest work was at the mass graves, and the men who exhumed the corpses for cremation were barely able to stand on their feet because of the sickening odors." So, he said the EXCAVATOR exhumed the corpses, he spoke of workers exhuming corpses at the mass graves, and he said the workers piled the corpses on the pyre. If that is not clear enough the EXCAVATOR exhumed the corpses, but the workers did the rest; Rajchman said; "The excavator starts to dig out the deadโhands, feet, heads separately. The Artist, being a specialist, orders the machine operators to dump the remains in a circle so that the carriers with their litters (these are now different litters, box-like in shape, so that nothing will fall out of them while running fast) can quickly run over, grab the human body parts with their hands, throw them into the litters and quickly carry them to the ovens." Rajchman is clear, the workers carry the corpses to the pyres and the EXCAVATOR was only used to dig out the bodies and dump them next to the grave. Will you now also apologise for claiming I lied that the EXCAVATORS were only used to uncover the corpses, since workers worked at the graves and carried the bodies to the pyres and piled them on?
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 17:11:57 GMT
Your lying has reached epic proportions.
You have lied that I said a clamshell exhumed the corpses.
You lied by claiming I lied that the witnesses said excavators.
You lied that the witnesses said dragline.
You have lied about my claim about the role of the excavator and how the Sonderkommados carried the bodies to the pyres.
There is something wrong with you, that you lie so much.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Sept 30, 2022 17:31:11 GMT
LOL! Nessie has his tit in the wringer and is frantically trying to get disentangled. The M&H (Menck & Hambrock) draglines were the only equipment allegedly used at Treblinka II. The photo evidence and the holyhoax "authorities" all agree that the M&H draglines equipped with clamshell buckets were the only equipment. You can call them "excavators" or "diggers" or "seilbaggers" or "korpaka" or whatever the hell you want but they will still remain just machinery built by Menck and Hambrock.
Wiernik DID say that the dragline could lift 3,000 cadavers at a time. I'll have to dig out my copy of "The Last Jew" to find the complete quote from Rajchman about how the cadavers were exhumed. I recall how Rajchman described how it took two men to throw the cadavers on the grate. In any event, whole bodies can't be exhumed from a mass grave with a clamshell.
Nessie can call the dragline whatever he wants but the fact remains that whole bodies weren't exhumed with a clamshell. We also have Wiernik saying that the grates were 100 to 150 meters long but then shrinking them to about 30 meters in his model. Rajchman describes how pieces and parts are exhumed but also describes how two men throw the cadavers onto the crematory grates.
The fact remains that Nessie lied about the draglines being used only to uncover the graves.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 18:07:37 GMT
LOL! Nessie has his tit in the wringer and is frantically trying to get disentangled. The M&H (Menck & Hambrock) draglines were the only equipment allegedly used at Treblinka II. The photo evidence and the holyhoax "authorities" all agree that the M&H draglines equipped with clamshell buckets were the only equipment. You can call them "excavators" or "diggers" or "seilbaggers" or "korpaka" or whatever the hell you want but they will still remain just machinery built by Menck and Hambrock. Wiernik DID say that the dragline could lift 3,000 cadavers at a time. I'll have to dig out my copy of "The Last Jew" to find the complete quote from Rajchman about how the cadavers were exhumed. I recall how Rajchman described how it took two men to throw the cadavers on the grate. In any event, whole bodies can't be exhumed from a mass grave with a clamshell. Nessie can call the dragline whatever he wants but the fact remains that whole bodies weren't exhumed with a clamshell. We also have Wiernik saying that the grates were 100 to 150 meters long but then shrinking them to about 30 meters in his model. Rajchman describes how pieces and parts are exhumed but also describes how two men throw the cadavers onto the crematory grates. The fact remains that Nessie lied about the draglines being used only to uncover the graves. Like this exchange, where I said "Excavators uncovered the corpses which were collected by Sonderkommandos."
You replied "You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies"
But we all know that is not true, they said excavators, not draglines and you are the liar, you are doing it again about the exhumations.
I have quoted what the witnesses said, which was that EXCAVATORS, not draglines, dug the corpses up from the grave and then Sonderkommados gathered the bodies, carried them to the pyres and placed them on the pyres. There is no mention of the EXCAVATORS being used to take the bodies to the pyres or place the bodies on the pyres.
Lying is clearly part of how you are. You need to lie to make your moronic, fallacious arguments work. It is pointless discussing anything with you any more, because of your lying.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Sept 30, 2022 18:19:12 GMT
LOL! Pssssst! Nessie! What kind of equipment and who built it was at Treblinka II? Wanna' see some photos of it?
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Sept 30, 2022 18:21:13 GMT
LOL! Nessie has his tit in the wringer and is frantically trying to get disentangled. The M&H (Menck & Hambrock) draglines were the only equipment allegedly used at Treblinka II. The photo evidence and the holyhoax "authorities" all agree that the M&H draglines equipped with clamshell buckets were the only equipment. Lie, they all think that they were the excavators used, they did not say they were the only ones used. Lie, you have no evidence that specific excavator was the one described by the witnesses. Lie, he said "dig up" not lift. Lie, Rajchman never used the term clamshell, he only ever said excavator. No one claimed they were, you are lying to suggest anyone did. Lie, Wiernik does not give a scale for his model. The only thing you have got correct! You are lying, as I never said a dragline was used, I said excavator. You have been destroyed by your lies. Give up.
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