The Lies of the Witnesses

Nessie wrote:

I don't care if the dragline was built by M&H or Bucyrus-Erie, a dragline with ~35 foot boom can't, by itself and unaided by auxiliary equipment dig the pits described by the eyewitnesses.

I did NOT claim that the witnesses were the source for identifying the "digger/excavator" as being the M&H dragline. Nessie coined that lie and is now trying to weasel dodge and lie his way out of it. That I used the term "dragline" instead of "digger/excavator" is what Nessie is trying to use to obfuscate the fact that I have never claimed that the M&H dragline was identified by those witnesses. Nessie needs to admit his lie, offer an apology and move on to the corroboration of Gley's description of how the crematory grate was constructed and how cadavers were used to fuel the cremations.

You just did exactly that. You have just said a dragline with a 35ft boom and as described by the witnesses, which means you are attributing that specific excavator to the witnesses.



You have dodged explaining what you meant by the follow quotes;

In this post you discuss Rosenberg, Wiernik and Rajchman

rodoh.info/post/5960

and go into detail about what they said then conclude "the M&H dragline did NOT dig the graves". You are clearly insinuating they said that was the excavator used. In this post;

rodoh.info/post/4582

you said " When Wiernik said that the dragline..."

In the following posts you said;

rodoh.info/post/1659

"The notion that the M&H draglines both excavated and stockpiled the ex from the graves as described by Wiernik..."

rodoh.info/post/9947

"Wiernik claimed five graves and Rajchman said eleven graves. Nessie says that the graves were 100 meters long. None of those graves could have been excavated with the M&H mB dragline.

rodoh.info/post/9588

"Rajchman, Wiernik and Rosenberg all claim that the dimensions of the graves were different, the number of graves were different and shared only the common feature of being impossible to dig with the M&H dragline."

rodoh.info/post/6075

"Wiernik said that an excavator was used to "dig out the trenches". ...It is impossible for the M&H Mb dragline to dig such "trenches".

You constantly refence the M&H dragline with the witness claims. You never use the actual witness descriptions, such as Wiernik stating excavator. You have been caught lying and there will be no other discussion until you admit to lying about what the witnesses said and you promise to only use the term, such as excavator, that the witness actually used.

(sigh) The witnesses called them "diggers" or "excavators". The Germans call them "seilbaggers" or just "'baggers". I call them "draglines". The Chinese probably have a name for them, too. Nessie doubles down on his lie that I attributed the identification of the M&H dragline (digger, excavator, seilbagger, 'bagger, dragline) to the witnesses. I attributed that identification to other sources but Nessie continues to lie that I said that the witnesses identified the diggers, excavators, etc. as M&H mA and mB draglines. It's just one of Nessie's sleazy little sly lies that he won't let go of.

No, neither did I uses the appellation of "seilbagger" or "'bagger". Neither have I ever claimed that the equipment in question was ever identified as an M&H mA or mB by the witnesses. As said, that identification came from other sources.

Of course I called the "digger/excavator" a dragline. That's the term regularly used by Americans to describe that type of equipment. I didn't call it a "seilbagger" or a "'bagger" or whatever the Chinese call a dragline. Nessie is still trying to weasel dodge the fact that I claimed the witnesses identified the dragline as a M&H mA or mB. So, YOU be honest, Nessie, and quote me declaring that the digger, bagger, whatever was identified by the witnesses. Of course you can't do that and thus all the smoke and horse frocky about what the dragline was called. That has nothing to do with how the equipment was identified.

I have provided numerous examples of where you did not use the terms the witnesses used and instead you dishonestly substituted terms they did not use. You repeatedly used the terms dragline and M&H dragline, when the witness did not say that.



Why did you not use Wiernik's own description?



I have provided you with numerous quotes where you claim the witnesses have referred to the dragline or M&H dragline;

" When Wiernik said that the dragline..."

"The notion that the M&H draglines both excavated and stockpiled the ex from the graves as described by Wiernik..."

"Wiernik claimed five graves and Rajchman said eleven graves. Nessie says that the graves were 100 meters long. None of those graves could have been excavated with the M&H mB dragline.

"Rajchman, Wiernik and Rosenberg all claim that the dimensions of the graves were different, the number of graves were different and shared only the common feature of being impossible to dig with the M&H dragline."

"Wiernik said that an excavator was used to "dig out the trenches". ...It is impossible for the M&H Mb dragline to dig such "trenches".

"I should amend my statement to a "credible witness" not some lying POS like Wiernik. Do you actually expect people to believe that the gas chambers were hermetically sealed? That he got his ears nailed to a wall? That the dragline could pick 3,000 cadavers at a time?"

"You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies"



I just did, I even quoted you telling me I was lying and that both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline was used.



Your argument that an excavator could not excavate a pit as described by the witnesses, does not work. That is why you dishonestly substituted dragline and M&H dragline to the discussion about what the witnesses described.

Back this exchange;

I said "Excavators uncovered the corpses which were collected by Sonderkommandos."

You replied "You lie. Both Wiernik and Rajchman said that the dragline exhumed the bodies"

Be honest, what did Weirnik and Rajchman actually say? Was it dragline as you claim, yes or no?

Nessie wrote:

There's nothing dishonest about calling a "digger" a dragline. Neither is it dishonest to call it a "seilbagger" or just a "'bagger". Those are just labels for the type of equipment supposedly used to dig the graves and exhume the cadavers at Treblinka. Neither do the names have anything to do with how the draglines were identified as being of Monk and Hambrock mfg.

Because Wiernik was an ignorant Jew and didn't know that the "digger" had a proper American name.

What the hell does that have to do with how the equipment was identified?

You just lied. None of the witnesses ever identified the equipment as being a Monk and Hambrock mA or mB. The identification came from other sources such as the photos of the machines and that those specific machines were used at Treblinka II by Arad, ARC, Colls et al.

Like hell it doesn't. That M&H mB could NOT have both dug and stockpiled 360 cubic meters of ex per meter of excavation without auxiliary equipment. Neither does that have anything to do with how the M&H mB was identified.

Both Wiernik and Rajchman described how the dragline (digger, excavator, seilbagger, 'bagger, whatever) exhumed bodies from the graves. Wiernik described how it lifted 3,000 cadavers at a time. Rajchman described how the operator would drop bodies on the sonderkommandos and how the sonderkommandos then carried the cadavers to the cremation grates. You lied about what Wiernik and Rajchman claimed. Whether Wiernik and Rajchman used the term "dragline" is irrelevant bullsh!t and you know it, Nessie.

Why would a Polish Jew who did not speak English, use an American - English term?

He used the term excavator and you have repeatedly lied that he used other terms. Stop lying.