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Post by Ulios on Apr 21, 2022 20:32:49 GMT
Nessie is about as honest as the witnesses he cites. Harsh
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Post by been_there on Apr 22, 2022 5:28:23 GMT
Nessie is about as honest as the witnesses he cites. Harsh ...but accurate! 🙂
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Post by Turnagain on Apr 22, 2022 6:48:55 GMT
Nessie wrote:
I'm curious why Nessie thinks that the pits, if not dug by the Germans, were dug prior to 1942. Treblinka came under control of the Soviets and communist Poland in 1944 and remained under their control for decades. The Poles still retain control over it.
The Soviets never showed any compunction about manufacturing spurious evidence if it fit their propaganda needs and as I said, Poland was part of the communist bloc for decades. Nessie says that the Poles built the monument and the investigatory barrier in 1960 and I'll take his word for it. It's also noted that the Soviets used it as a bombing/artillery range in the mid to late 40s. Then we have the grave robbers. There's no shortage of likely candidates for the cause of the alleged pits.
There's also CS-C's suspect data. Why hasn't she ever shown the actual GPR scans that she claims to have made at Treblinka? Why has she never returned to Treblinka to continue the investigation as she "hoped" to do? Why are all of the alleged pits irregularly shaped while the witnesses describe all of the graves as being rectangular prisms? These are all legitimate questions that Nessie simply hand waves away.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Apr 22, 2022 8:46:20 GMT
Nessie wrote: I'm curious why Nessie thinks that the pits, if not dug by the Germans, were dug prior to 1942. Treblinka came under control of the Soviets and communist Poland in 1944 and remained under their control for decades. The Poles still retain control over it. The Soviets never showed any compunction about manufacturing spurious evidence if it fit their propaganda needs and as I said, Poland was part of the communist bloc for decades. Nessie says that the Poles built the monument and the investigatory barrier in 1960 and I'll take his word for it. It's also noted that the Soviets used it as a bombing/artillery range in the mid to late 40s. Then we have the grave robbers. There's no shortage of likely candidates for the cause of the alleged pits. The 1943 Kurt Franz photos proves excavators were used at TII. The 1944 aerial photo proves the camp was dug over and the rectangular outlines prove that there are underground disturbances, prior to Soviet arrival.
Add that to all the witness evidence and there is absolute proof it was the Nazis.
You refuse to answer my follow up questions. Why are the GPR images she shows unacceptable as evidence? Show me an example of an irregular shaped pit. The report describes many as rectilinear, with straight edges. Are you going by the roughly drawn overlays on the aerial photos that only indicate where pits were found? In any case, why do you expect perfectly shaped graves when they were dug into and then subjected to grave robbing. You still refuse to explain why the Nazis dug such large pits and are weasel dodging, because you know there is only one answer.
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Post by Turnagain on Apr 22, 2022 9:26:00 GMT
How does the photo of a dragline prove that it was at Treblinka II?
There are lots of rectangular shapes shown in the aerial photos of the camp and its surrounding area. There are no definitive rectangles shown in the camp itself.
Name your witnesses and link to their accounts of the giant mass graves.
CS-C presents only one (1) photo of a GPR scan.
For the irregularly shaped pits look no further than CS-C's map overlay. No rectangles.
Now, name one Jew witness who gives a coherent and believable account of the holyhoax. Link to his testimony.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Apr 22, 2022 11:32:35 GMT
How does the photo of a dragline prove that it was at Treblinka II? Because the last Commander of TII took it, along with other photos from his time at the camp. How did you forget that? You are blind, there are clear rectangular shapes visible in the aerial photo. You need me to link you, yet again, to the Sonderkommando and Nazi testimony? OK, here, again, for the 1000th time www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=32918What is wrong with the other GPR images? That is just how someone marked the location of the pits on a map, using some sort of online overlay. The report describes most of the pits as rectilinear. See link above. Now, stop weasel dodging and tell me what the Nazis buried in the large pits located around the larger memorial.
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Post by Turnagain on Apr 22, 2022 13:26:11 GMT
Nessie wrote:
The quarry was just 500 meters south of T-II, a pleasant stroll from T-II. Why wouldn't Franz take a few photos of the draglines in operation at the quarry? More to the point, how do you KNOW that he didn't do that?
As far as the rectangular shapes being plainly visible in the aerial photos, let's see them. Why is it impossible for them to be the outlines of buildings at T-II? There are at least three different eyewitnesses who saw the graves and three different descriptions of the graves and for the number of the graves. Which eyewitness are you claiming told the truth?
Your links at the Klown's forum don't work. Then we have your laundry list and no specific witnesses to the graves. As usual, you weasel dodge.
CS-C posts only one (1) photo of a GPR scan. You've been shown what GPR scans look like and while CS-C talks about GPR she shows only one photo of a 10 meter long strip of ground.
Here is the definition of rectilinear from Merriam-Webster:
Rectilinear does not, repeat NOT, mean rectangular.
I see that you're continuing with your weasel dodge of naming a Jew witness and linking to his testimony about the alleged homicidal events that supposedly took place at Treblinka. So it goes in holyhoax la-la land.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Apr 22, 2022 16:45:22 GMT
Nessie wrote: The quarry was just 500 meters south of T-II, a pleasant stroll from T-II. Why wouldn't Franz take a few photos of the draglines in operation at the quarry? More to the point, how do you KNOW that he didn't do that? The land in the Kurt Franz photos is flat, unlike a quarry. Do you know what a quarry is? I cannot really help you with your eyes. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treblinka_extermination_camp#/media/File:Treblinka_II_aerial_photo_(1944).jpgCan you see the buildings in the photo? All of them. You would need to log in. You claim to have read witness evidence, we have discussed what they said about graves, now you deny they describe graves, what is wrong with you? What is wrong with the other GPR images she posts? You weasel dodge that I have linked you to numerous credible witnesses. You do that to weasel dodge evidencing what the Nazis were burying in the large pits geophysics found around the larger memorial, in the area where witnesses described mass graves.
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Post by Turnagain on Apr 23, 2022 1:47:32 GMT
Nessie wrote:
LOL! Yes, Nessie, I'm very familiar with what gravel quarries look like and to my experienced eye, the draglines appear to be working in a quarry. You can claim that in your opinion the draglines are working inside a camp but that's just your opinion. I asked you, "How do you KNOW that the draglines are working in T-II?".
Nessie then produces a small aerial photo of the area with an OVERLAY by WIKIPEDIA of what they claim is the camp layout. The actual photo shows no such detail but of course Nessie claims that wiki is the go to, 100% reliable source for all things holyhoax. Anything or anybody who agrees with Nessie about the holyhoax is absolutely accurate and 100% reliable. So there!
Nessie then claims that the three witnesses who gave wildly differing dimensions and the number of graves ALL told the truth about the dimensions and number of graves. That is a real life demonstration of Orwell's concept of doublethink. Nessie lives in the alternate universe of holyhoax la-la land.
Nessie continues to weasel dodge my request for him to name a Jew who gives a coherent and reasonable account of the homicidal events that allegedly took place at Treblinka. I've been banned from the Klown's forum so of course I can't use the links Nessie gives. In any event, even at the Klown's forum he refuses to name a Jew who gives a reasonable account of the functioning of Treblinka as an extermination facility. He absolutely refuses to name one specific Jew who witnessed the alleged homicidal events and link to his testimony. Of course he won't do that since the supposed eyewitnesses all gave absurd fantasies of how the Germans supposedly committed mass murder. Nessie is aware of that and knows that the tales of anyone he can choose will be picked apart like an over-cooked chicken. He isn't going to try and defend the tales of electric masturbation machines or the rickety jungle gym target range for shooting Jews. Nessie has weasel dodging down to a fine art.
CS-C showed one (1) image of a GPR scan for a 10 meter long strip of land. CS-C TALKS about GPR scans and shows what she claims to be interpretations taken from actual GPR scans but shows only ONE, (1) actual GPR scan. Nessie absolutely refuses to acknowledge what a GPR scan looks like although he's been linked to numerous examples of actual scans and how they're used. Bottom line, Nessie is just weasel dodging the fact that CS-C presented only one GPR image in her thesis.
The most likely scenario for CS-C and Treblinka is that she did complete a GPR scan of the area and like Krege, found bupkis for mass graves. Then amidst clouds of, "it's an ongoing investigation" and, "I 'HOPE' to return this year" and "probable graves" she packed up and left Treblinka never to return to the site of her embarrassment. That's just my take on her so-called investigation but her actions support my suppositions.
(sigh) I didn't ask you for "numerous credible witnesses"; your laundry list. I asked you to name ONE (1) witness to the homicidal events that allegedly took place at Treblinka and link to his testimony. Nessie is claiming to not know the difference between "numerous" and "one". That's like claiming to not know the difference between a herd of cows and a single cow or the difference between a single crow and a whole flock of them. Even amongst the mentally deficient the concept of "one" and "many" is readily apparent so Nessie is weasel dodging my request.
Nessie is aware of the fact that the witnesses' statements are essentially fantasies and he'll have to resort to his excuses, "exaggerations", "emotive language" etc. to explain their lies all accompanied by his "what ifs" and "coulda woulda". Nessie knows that such horse frocky doesn't hold water so is trying to avoid that by weasel dodging my request. More doublethink from Nessie. He knows the witnesses are lying but also fervently believes them. Life in holyhoax la-la land.
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Post by Nessie on Apr 23, 2022 7:44:38 GMT
This thread is about why the Nazis dug so many large pits at TII.
You weasel dodge that there are contemporaneous photos from 1943, showing excavators at TII from the last camp Commander Kurt Franz and he did not photo them working inside the quarry. You try and waesel dodge the 1944 aerial photo, taken before the Soviets arrived, that clearly shows disturbed ground and rectangular outlines. Add those photos to the other evidence, from witnesse and that proves the Nazis dug the pits.
You want GPR scans, which you would not be able to interpret anyway, rather than the other GPR images produced, but you cannot explain why the other images have no evidencial value.
You go off topic to ask a question that has already been answered on numerous occasions with various credible witnesses and their testimony.
That is all happening because you know that the Nazis dug the pits and buried bodies in them.
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Post by Turnagain on Apr 23, 2022 10:50:50 GMT
Nessie wrote:
You have absolutely no proof of that assertion. You have some photos of draglines allegedly taken by Franz. If Franz claimed that he took those photos at T-II then link to that testimony.
I didn't say that CS-C's other images had no evidential value. What I SAID was that CS-C shows only one image of a GPR scan in her thesis. Why did CS-C post only ONE (1) image of a GPR scan? The most likely reason for that is because she didn't want other people to see those scans. That and her subsequent lack of activity at T-II is strong evidence that what she claimed to have found at T-II is spurious. That isn't proof but that's what the evidence leads to. It's evidence of chicanery.
Nessie continues to weasel dodge my request that he name one Jew witness to the alleged homicidal events that supposedly took place at T-II and link to his testimony. He obviously intends to never respond to that request but simply repeats his mantra of, "I already done that".
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Apr 23, 2022 14:15:35 GMT
Nessie wrote: You have absolutely no proof of that assertion. You have some photos of draglines allegedly taken by Franz. If Franz claimed that he took those photos at T-II then link to that testimony. The photos were found in an album when his home was searched. They included photos of others who worked at TII and "Barry" the dog, whom others mentioned was kept at the camp. Some details here; military-history.fandom.com/wiki/Kurt_FranzYet again, when you are shown one type of evidence, you claim not good enough, you need to see a different type of evidence. For example, the cremated remains found at the AR camps. You do not accept archaeologists physical examination and instead you want lab testing. Then, when you are shown lab testing, that is not good enough and you want more lab testing. It is one of your tactics to dodge how much evidence there is. You have still not answered what the Nazis were burying in the large pits geophysics located around the larger memorial.
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Post by Turnagain on Apr 23, 2022 15:06:13 GMT
Nessie wrote:
So? What does that have to do with whether the photos were taken at T-I or T-II? Oh, that's right, it has absolutely NOTHING, zip, zero, nada to do with where the photographs were taken but Nessie throws it out as a smoke screen to obfuscate his lack of any proof of where the photos were taken.
Nessie continues to blow smoke in order to obfuscate the fact that CS-C published only one GPR scan in her thesis. He makes wild accusations in hopes of deflecting away from the fact that the lack of GPR scans and CS-C's actions at T-II are evidence of chicanery and cast a shadow on her so called findings.
Of course he ignores my request that he provide the name of one Jew eyewitness to the alleged atrocities at T-II and link to his testimony.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Apr 23, 2022 15:25:45 GMT
Nessie wrote: So? What does that have to do with whether the photos were taken at T-I or T-II? Oh, that's right, it has absolutely NOTHING, zip, zero, nada to do with where the photographs were taken but Nessie throws it out as a smoke screen to obfuscate his lack of any proof of where the photos were taken. Kurt Franz commanded TII. He photographed others who worked at TII. His photos do not show the quarry or TI. Publishing one scan, along with all of the other GPR and geophysical evidence is not evidence of chicanery. You are trying to think up excuses to dispute the evidence because it does not suit you. You have not explained or evidenced what the Nazis buried in the large pits found around the larger memorial. Your attempts to deflect from that, by trolling the thread about another issue are being ignored.
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Post by Turnagain on Apr 23, 2022 20:52:30 GMT
Nessie wrote: Nessie stamps his feet and shrieks, "Did not, did not", but offers no proof that the photos were taken at T-II. Franz was fond of horseback riding so the notion that he took photos of T-II only is absurd. The GPR scans were crucial to what CS-C claimed to have found at Treblinka. You can shriek, "Is not, is not" till the cows come home but that fact and her not returning to Treblinka as part of an ongoing investigation along with her statement that the pits that she claimed to have found were only possible/probable graves is indeed evidence of chicanery on her part. Publishing the scans as an addendum to her thesis would have been a simple matter.
You've not proven that the Germans dug all of the pits supposedly located by CS-C at Treblinka.
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