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Post by been_there on Feb 5, 2022 12:00:31 GMT
Show the original intercept. That would confirm the decode to be a forgery or confirm it to be valid. What can't you understand about that? ...It is very suspicious that you have made no enquiries to trace the original intercept, or establish if it has been archived, or if there is no record of it at all... ๐คฃ๐๐
The dishonest avoidance of this person becomes ever more idiotic and laughable.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Feb 5, 2022 12:21:38 GMT
If Witte and Tyas want their marvelous discovery to be taken seriously then it's up to them to provide the original intercept. It' not just the errors but the type of error. You are too ignorant to be able to understand that, though. It is up to you to evidence it is forged. The burden of proof is on you. All you need to do is contact the National Archive.
It is very suspicious you have not done that.
The type of error is consistent with a primitive system that had just been developed for a brand-new coding machine.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Feb 5, 2022 12:30:30 GMT
No, Dimmy, it isn't up to me to prove that Witte and Tyas are telling the truth. They made the claim and it's up to them to prove it. As far as the type of error I referenced, you apparently can't even comprehend what it is.
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Post by Nessie on Feb 5, 2022 13:00:04 GMT
No, Dimmy, it isn't up to me to prove that Witte and Tyas are telling the truth. They made the claim and it's up to them to prove it. As far as the type of error I referenced, you apparently can't even comprehend what it is. Your claim is the telegram is a fake. It is up to you to evidence and prove that. You have made a reasonable suggestion as to how that can be done, but very suspiciously, you refuse to do so.
The errors are explainable by you not understanding their procedures and alleging errors where there are none, and typos and mistakes when receiving, typing and decoding the message.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Feb 5, 2022 14:01:26 GMT
Jeezus H, but Nessie just can't give the lies a rest. I haven't claimed that the telegram is a fake. I said that there is doubt as to its authenticity and there is. That could be resolved if the original intercept was available. Witte and Tyas have access to the archive so why haven't they produced it? Nessie claims that it's suspicious that I don't go to the archive and dig up the intercept.
The errors in the Hofle letter are there for all to see. The previous decode has the call signs and chatter recorded perfectly but the entire message is marked "rest missed". That nothing at all was copied of the message is, as I said, a VERY large red flag. That an intercept op wouldn't even attempt to copy some of the message is ridiculous. Especially since it was an enigma intercept. Nessie's claim that the "error" is due to me not knowing British intercept protocols is complete bullshit. The red flag comes from the notation in the decode.
Nessie also claimed that the Ganzenmuller letter and the Stroop report were proof of the holyhoax. Not even the Jews are claiming that the Ganzenmuller letter is unequivocally authentic and the Stroop report is a known forgery. With the shaky Hofle letter he's batting 0 for 3.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Feb 5, 2022 15:16:56 GMT
Jeezus H, but Nessie just can't give the lies a rest. I haven't claimed that the telegram is a fake. I said that there is doubt as to its authenticity and there is. Forevermore you will dismiss the Hofle Telegram in the same way you dismiss the Stroop Report. Which it is. It would not be difficult for you to contact the archive and ask about the original intercept. The "rest missed" is a previous intercept, it is not from the Hofle Telegram. The page has 5 intercepts, of which one is the Hofle Telegram. No, they are documentary evidence, not proof. Yet again you have made a false claim. A second letter that was worded very like the Ganzenmuller Letter is what that article was about. The original Ganzenmuller Letter is authentic, as is the Stroop Report, or Reports, since there were three of them, once of which was recovered when Stroop was arrested. That is 3/3, where you have no evidence of faking.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Feb 5, 2022 15:29:43 GMT
LOL! Nessie's Hofle telegram is dodgy, the Ganzenmuller letter might be a phony and the Stroop report certainly is fake. That's some evidence you have there, Nessie. It's all right up there with the hermetically sealed gas chambers and the magic Jew barbeque. But "everyone" agrees that the holyhoax happened. Suuuure they do.....in holyhoax la-la land.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Feb 5, 2022 15:53:29 GMT
LOL! Nessie's Hofle telegram is dodgy, You are dodging that you think the intercept before was part of the Hofle Telegram! What a howler! You are clearly clueless. You have again got it wrong. The original Ganzenmuller Letter is not what that article is about!!! Why would Stroop fake a report he had on him when he was arrested and had sent a copy to Himmler? All you are doing is proving you can barely read, let alone understand. No wonder you are too scared to contact the National Archive and do some investigation for yourself.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Feb 5, 2022 16:02:22 GMT
LMAO! Nessie stamps his feet and shrieks, "It's true, it's all true". Yeah, especially that magic Jew barbeque. Glad I don't live in holyhoax la-la land.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Feb 5, 2022 16:19:12 GMT
LMAO! Nessie stamps his feet and shrieks, "It's true, it's all true". Yeah, especially that magic Jew barbeque. Glad I don't live in holyhoax la-la land. You are still dodging that you got mixed up about what was the Hofle Telegram and another different intercept on the same page, despite the Hofle Telegram being highlighted!
You are also dodging that the news article here;
is questioning a letter from a Dr. Theodor Ganzenmuller on the 19th July 1942,
"But the document, expected to fetch $930, is an almost identical copy of another well-documented letter used in evidence at the Nuremberg Trials, which is dated July 28 1942."
The original document used at Nuremberg is from Albert Ganzenmuller, dated the 28th of July 1942, shown here;
No one is disputing the original. You have made mistakes, own up to them.
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Post by ๐๐ฌ๐ซ๐๐๐ on Feb 5, 2022 16:37:44 GMT
Calling people "clueless" in not acceptable nor is discussing the Stroop report unless this directly connects with the telegram in question. The use of the term "dodging" is a cliche and should not be used; it bring nothing to the discussion.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Feb 5, 2022 16:41:15 GMT
No, what you don't understand is that the page of deoodes might be fraudulent. As far as Nuremberg, that "high grade lynching" was nothing but the revenge/coverup marsupial escapades of the century. A show-trial. Giddoutahere!
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Post by Nessie on Feb 5, 2022 16:46:46 GMT
No, what you don't understand is that the page of deoodes might be fraudulent. As far as Nuremberg, that "high grade lynching" was nothing but the revenge/coverup marsupial escapades of the century. A show-trial. Giddoutahere! Why would a fraudster write that he has missed what was sent to Eichmann? If it is a forgery, it is a very odd one to do. Why not include something highly incriminating, especially regarding Eichmann?
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Post by Ulios on Feb 5, 2022 16:48:11 GMT
No, what you don't understand is that the page of deoodes might be fraudulent. As far as Nuremberg, that "high grade lynching" was nothing but the revenge/coverup marsupial escapades of the century. A show-trial. Giddoutahere! At this level of intrigue it is likely volumes of decodes are fraudulent; they are of course still classified due to their function in black ops. This is however, walking in the realm of conspiracy theory. During that era there were real conspiracies of course, this was the start of the Cold War.
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Post by been_there on Feb 7, 2022 8:33:09 GMT
I have been reading again the article written by Witte and Tyas, that was publshed in 2001.
They spend quite a large amount of the article explaining away all the ways the alleged Hรถfle decrypt (and the Korherr report) doesnโt fit with other beliefs that make up the โholyco$tโ industryโs credo.
E.g. on page 478 they write this:
Here they give some detail on the interception. The more I read, the more the objectivity of their research looks suspect. And therefore the more the authenticity of this intercept being casually discovered by one lucky pick of one out of 101 file archives seems non-credible.
For example, how could they claim so soon after the decrypts were declassified, that โunfortunately, no similar decode about Einsatz Reinhardt operations is to be found within the material declassified to dateโ ?
Could they genuinely have read all the several hundred thousand of decrypts by the time of writing their analysis of this one decrypt file from 11th Jan 1943?
The claim is made elsewhere that they only spotted this one and understood what it was referring to because while going through the many thousands of decrypts, โ...Tyas and Witte were able to identify the Hรถfle telegram because the running total (1.2 million) caught their eye; they knew it from the Korherr Report, which gave that number for the total "processed through camps in the Generalgouvernement".
Hmmmmmm? ๐ค
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