Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Jan 7, 2022 15:49:15 GMT
Uh-huh, the victors order the Germans to "de-Nazify" other Germans with a series of show trials. Especially scrub clean the minds of the little kiddies. Sell your politicized marsupial escapades down the street, Nessie. Stamp your feet and shriek as loudly as you want but those political maneuvers and the ridiculous testimonies will remain nothing but some low grade show trials.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Jan 7, 2022 16:08:59 GMT
Uh-huh, the victors order the Germans to "de-Nazify" other Germans with a series of show trials. Especially scrub clean the minds of the little kiddies. Sell your politicized marsupial escapades down the street, Nessie. Stamp your feet and shriek as loudly as you want but those political maneuvers and the ridiculous testimonies will remain nothing but some low grade show trials. The Allies gave the Germans the chance to deal with the Nazis themselves. That is not normal for a show trial.
You can stamp your feet and shriek all you want, the Nazis admitted to their crimes and their admissions were corroborated by other evidence.
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Post by ๐๐๐จ๐ญ๐ญ on Jan 7, 2022 17:10:36 GMT
I'm not sure you can truly defend your clients in a Kafkaesque show-trial. Basically, you try to minimize your client's involvement and secure his unconditional cooperation and slander or silence in exchange for a lenient sentence. An honest defense would be like trying to convince the Inquisition that the Devil did not exist and expecting not to get thrown onto the dock and flayed alive yourself. Plus, the collaborationist German "Bundestablishment" (as I call it) that was installed and took over after the war were some of the vilest Center-Right and Leftists that one could imagine from an authentic Nationalist point of view. Many of them were and are worthy of a little pro-active fumigation โ had anybody been so inclined to mete out that kind of hygiene. I am not sure that West German show-trials were any better than the ones held by the Victors. In fact, the new stuff-shirted Pinko regime probably hated the accused even more than the Allies who fought the Good Fight and splendidly beat them.  |
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Jan 7, 2022 17:36:24 GMT
I don't think that Nessie has much interest in fair and impartial judges and honest testimony.
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Post by Nessie on Jan 7, 2022 17:36:49 GMT
I'm not sure you can truly defend your clients in a Kafkaesque show-trial. Basically, you try to minimize your client's involvement and secure his unconditional cooperation and slander or silence in exchange for a lenient sentence. An honest defense would be like trying to convince the Inquisition that the Devil did not exist and expecting not to get thrown onto the dock and flayed alive yourself. Plus, the collaborationist German "Bundestablishment" (as I call it) that was installed and took over after the war were some of the vilest Center-Right and Leftists that one could imagine from an authentic Nationalist point of view. Many of them were and are worthy of a little pro-active fumigation โ had anybody been so inclined to mete out that kind of hygiene. I am not sure that West German show-trials were any better than the ones held by the Victors. In fact, the new stuff-shirted Pinko regime probably hated the accused even more than the Allies who fought the Good Fight and splendidly beat them. ... The only way to defend clients who admit to their crime, is to try and minimise their role and get an acquittal or minimal sentence. That is what happened, with most Belzec accused being acquitted and a series of minimal sentences. To establish your client's innocence, you would need evidence to prove that either he was not at the camp, or evidence that the mass murder claims about the camp are false, which would mean providing evidence as to what did happen. That would mean witnesses who were there and who would testify to something other than gassings. That deniers cannot provide any evidence as to what did happen, undermines all their claims that gassings did not happen. |
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Post by Nessie on Jan 7, 2022 17:38:23 GMT
I don't think that Nessie has much interest in fair and impartial judges and honest testimony. Considering that I insist on corroborating evidence and you don't think evidence is important at all, it is clearly you, not me, who is not interested in fairness. |
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Post by ๐๐๐จ๐ญ๐ญ on Jan 7, 2022 17:41:18 GMT
Not admitting your crime in a political trial is as good as cooking your own goose. Your guilt is a priori. That is the point. |
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Jan 7, 2022 17:47:06 GMT
Nessie wrote:
That's total bullshit. Of course there's evidence that Treblinka functioned as a transit camp. Same as for Sobibor.
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Post by Nessie on Jan 7, 2022 18:04:04 GMT
Not admitting your crime in a political trial is as good as cooking your own goose. Your guilt is a priori. That is the point.
The evidence for mass gassings was overwhelming. You are fooling yourself, thinking otherwise. Pleading not guilty, in the face of overwhelming evidence, would need overwhelming evidence of what really did happen. You cannot produce any evidence that something else happened in the AR camps, Chelmno or A-B.
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Post by Nessie on Jan 7, 2022 18:07:51 GMT
Nessie wrote: That's total bullshit. Of course there's evidence that Treblinka functioned as a transit camp. Same as for Sobibor. The evidence of limited selections, for people to go and work in labour camps in Poland. That also happened at Belzec and A-B. Your attempt to portray the camps as transit camps would be laughed out of court. You would have Helen Schwartz on the stand, insisting TII was a death camp! The Judge would be facepalming and suggesting you need another witness, or to just drop your claim!
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Jan 7, 2022 18:31:43 GMT
Nessie wrote:
You have no way of knowing how many Jews left Treblinka. There's only the testimony of a handful of witnesses but there were thousands of other people who could have transited through Treblinka. You have NO way of knowing how "limited" the "selections" were. In any event, the reason for the deportees to leave Treblinka isn't relevant to the fact that they DID leave there. There is the testimony from credible witnesses that they left Treblinka. There's documentary evidence from Majdanek and the USHMM to corroborate that testimony.
A claim that there's no evidence of anyone leaving Treblinka alive save a few escapees is bullshit. The witnesses state that at least three full trainloads of deportees left Treblinka for other destinations. It's claimed that a trainload of Jews amounted to 5-6,000 individuals so that's a minimum of 15,000 deportees who left Treblinka just from witness statements. Your "limited selections for work" is just more of your unsubstantiated bullshit.
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Post by been_there on Jan 7, 2022 19:21:49 GMT
Nessie wrote: So, no transcripts of the court proceedings. Imagine that. We have only excerpts from the holocaust research project. HRP can't be trusted any further than I can spit a rat. HRP claims to be quoting from transcripts so why can't the transcripts from the trials be found? Ha ha! ๐ That expression made me laugh out loud. And now I am wondering just how far anyone could โspit a ratโ. Not a visualisation or consideration that has ever occurred to me before. ๐ |
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Post by Nessie on Jan 7, 2022 19:40:36 GMT
Nessie wrote: You have no way of knowing how many Jews left Treblinka. There's only the testimony of a handful of witnesses but there were thousands of other people who could have transited through Treblinka. You have NO way of knowing how "limited" the "selections" were. In any event, the reason for the deportees to leave Treblinka isn't relevant to the fact that they DID leave there. There is the testimony from credible witnesses that they left Treblinka. There's documentary evidence from Majdanek and the USHMM to corroborate that testimony. A claim that there's no evidence of anyone leaving Treblinka alive save a few escapees is bullshit. The witnesses state that at least three full trainloads of deportees left Treblinka for other destinations. It's claimed that a trainload of Jews amounted to 5-6,000 individuals so that's a minimum of 15,000 deportees who left Treblinka just from witness statements. Your "limited selections for work" is just more of your unsubstantiated bullshit. OK, so you are defence for the Nazis, which witnesses do you call, to evidence TII was a transit camp? Name and quote them. |
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Post by Turnagain on Jan 9, 2022 21:58:16 GMT
Nessie has apparently moderated my answer to that question. Perhaps I just forgot to hit the "create post" button. Which was it, Nessie?
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Post by Nessie on Jan 10, 2022 8:53:25 GMT
Nessie has apparently moderated my answer to that question. Perhaps I just forgot to hit the "create post" button. Which was it, Nessie? I can assure you I have not moderated any response you made. Scott reports one of his posts disappeared and I have had the same. I have also had logging in issues, the forum is somewhat glitchy. |
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