Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Dec 30, 2021 23:57:27 GMT
Nessie wrote: You have been asked to produce some evidence that the photos from Dresden resulted in cremated cadavers. Your repeated response is the photos and the quote from an official. That never changes and is endlessly repeated. The fact is that there's NO proof that the bodies in the photo were actually cremated. The same for your tagline that there's no evidence of transports of deportees out of Treblinka. Yes, there's evidence that trainloads of deportees did depart from Treblinka. Your response is invariably that those deportees were just "selected" for work. Why is the purpose of their leaving Treblinka relevant to the fact that there were mass transports of deportees out of Treblinka?
So, no option for answering Nessie's drivel about his "evidence". Well, I suppose that there's no point in answering his gibberish but why not just post it to the existing gibberish thread?
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Dec 31, 2021 11:22:46 GMT
Nessie wrote: You have been asked to produce some evidence that the photos from Dresden resulted in cremated cadavers. Your repeated response is the photos and the quote from an official. That never changes and is endlessly repeated. The fact is that there's NO proof that the bodies in the photo were actually cremated. It is frustrating that you ask me for evidence, I produce the evidence, you claim that evidence does not constitute proof and then you wait and ask me for the evidence again. Your inability to remember what has been discussed and shown to you before, makes for repetitious posts. I have explained to you that the photos and the documents pertain to the same time and place, so it seems highly unlikely that your claim is correct and they are not connected. In any case, you have no evidence to back up your claim. There is no point in going over that again and again. It was not me who added the tagline. You are misinterpreting it. |
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Dec 31, 2021 12:29:44 GMT
Nessie wrote:
You have been asked to produce some evidence that the cadavers at Dresden were actually cremated. You reply with the suspect photos and the quote from the official that cadavers were cremated. Rinse and repeat. Where is your evidence of cremated or even charred cadavers? That's bodies that have been cremated or at least partially burned. IOW, do you have any evidence for the cremation process? Do you have any evidence except the dicky photos? Photos of the pile of bodies seem legitimate. The smoking bodies and the photo showing some flames, not so much.
IOW, you have no evidence to back up your assertion that the statement from the official is connected to the photos you've shown. You simply say, here's an official statement concerning cremations and here's a photo of a pile of bodies so the statement must be about the pile of bodies. There's no specific connection between the statement and the pile of cadavers. You state an opinion that it's "highly unlikely" that the official isn't talking about the pile of cadavers. A claim from you that something is "highly unlikely" is the ultimate irony.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Dec 31, 2021 16:37:32 GMT
Nessie wrote: You have been asked to produce some evidence that the cadavers at Dresden were actually cremated. You reply with the suspect photos and the quote from the official that cadavers were cremated. Rinse and repeat. Where is your evidence of cremated or even charred cadavers? That's bodies that have been cremated or at least partially burned. IOW, do you have any evidence for the cremation process? Do you have any evidence except the dicky photos? Photos of the pile of bodies seem legitimate. The smoking bodies and the photo showing some flames, not so much. This is where it gets frustrating. I clearly told you what the evidence I have is; 1 - the photos 2 - the document Why do you keep on then asking me to show you evidence. You do that a lot. You ask me for evidence, I show you everything I have, then you ask me again. Why do you do that? I don't hide evidence from you. You often criticise me for showing you all the evidence I have, calling it a laundry list. As for evidence of the cremation process, I have answered you on numerous occasions. That evidence is from the document. I have linked you to and quoted the relevant part of the document, which states cremations took place in the Altmarkt and the ashes were then taken to be buried in a cemetery. Again, the connection between the photos and the document has been explained to you, repeatedly. They are both from just after the air raid and are both of the Altmarkt and both show cremations. For you to suggest there is no connection, when there are multiple connections, is bizarre. |
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Post by been_there on Dec 31, 2021 18:24:04 GMT
You have been asked to produce some evidence that the cadavers at Dresden were actually cremated. You reply with the suspect photos and the quote from the official that cadavers were cremated. Rinse and repeat. Where is your evidence of cremated or even charred cadavers? That's bodies that have been cremated or at least partially burned. IOW, do you have any evidence for the cremation process? Do you have any evidence except the dicky photos? Photos of the pile of bodies seem legitimate. The smoking bodies and the photo showing some flames, not so much. This is where it gets frustrating. I clearly told you what the evidence I have is; 1 - the photos 2 - the document Why do you keep on then asking me to show you evidence... As for evidence of the cremation process, I have answered you on numerous occasions. That evidence is from the document. I have linked you to and quoted the relevant part of the document, which states cremations took place in the Altmarkt and the ashes were then taken to be buried in a cemetery. Again, the connection between the photos and the document has been explained to you, repeatedly. They are both from just after the air raid and are both of the Altmarkt and both show cremations. For you to suggest there is no connection, when there are multiple connections, is bizarre. As a person who claims to be a retired police investigator your inability to either reply to, or even understand, simple, straightforward questions repeatedly put to you does not inspire confidence in your claims. Let me try and spell it out for you. Turnagain just asked you this simple question: โDo you have any evidence except the dicky photos?โ
Do you understand the word โ exceptโ? If you do, now look at your answer โthe evidence I have is; 1 - the photosโ.
Can you now see that it is a clearly stupid answer. Do you understand now why it is a literally stupid answer? โโโโโโโโ- Secondly, Turnagain wrote to you: โyou have no evidence to back up your assertion that the statement from the official is connected to the photos you've shownโ.
So what do you do to further the argument? Do you provide evidence? No, you donโt. Turnagain explained: โ You simply say, here's an official statement concerning cremations and here's a photo of a pile of bodies so the statement must be about the pile of bodiesโ. He explains to you that is an opinion not โevidenceโ.Yet you reply: โ both show cremationsโ. !!! ๐ฎ๐คฆโโ๏ธ๐ But the photos OBVIOUSLY do NOT show โ cremationโ. Turnagain has already established that fact to you. Do you really not yet understand the difference between โcremationโ and โcarbonisationโ  ๐คฆโโ๏ธ This I suggest to you is the problem, you not only donโt understand simple distinctions and arguments, but you appear to not be able to understand simple words.  How to have a meaningful discussion with someone who does not understand simple words? |
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Dec 31, 2021 19:21:45 GMT
This is where it gets frustrating. I clearly told you what the evidence I have is; 1 - the photos 2 - the document Why do you keep on then asking me to show you evidence... As for evidence of the cremation process, I have answered you on numerous occasions. That evidence is from the document. I have linked you to and quoted the relevant part of the document, which states cremations took place in the Altmarkt and the ashes were then taken to be buried in a cemetery. Again, the connection between the photos and the document has been explained to you, repeatedly. They are both from just after the air raid and are both of the Altmarkt and both show cremations. For you to suggest there is no connection, when there are multiple connections, is bizarre. As a person who claims to be a retired police investigator your inability to either reply to, or even understand, simple, straightforward questions repeatedly put to you does not inspire confidence in your claims. Let me try and spell it out for you. Turnagain just asked you this simple question: โDo you have any evidence except the dicky photos?โ
Do you understand the word โ exceptโ? If you do, now look at your answer โthe evidence I have is; 1 - the photosโ.
Can you now see that it is a clearly stupid answer. Do you understand now why it is a literally stupid answer? โโโโโโโโ- Turnagain asked more than just the question about the photos. He asked; "IOW, do you have any evidence for the cremation process? Do you have any evidence except the dicky photos?" He has been dodging the document since I first posted it. It is the document that evidences the cremations actually went ahead and were completed. Turnagain is dodging what the evidence from the photos and document show. Where is your evidence that the pyres at Dresden were merely to "carbonise" the bodies? I have produced photos that show pyres being built and set on fire at the Altmarkt after the air raids and a document that records c6700 bodies were cremated to ashes at the Altmarkt after the air raids. Any suggestion the two are not connected needs to be evidenced. |
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Agandaur
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Post by Agandaur on Dec 31, 2021 19:48:04 GMT
I have produced photos that show pyres being built and set on fire at the Altmarkt after the air raids and a document that records c6700 bodies were cremated to ashes at the Altmarkt after the air raids. Any suggestion the two are not connected needs to be evidenced. I doubt the claim of burning to ashes. |
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Dec 31, 2021 19:59:57 GMT
I have produced photos that show pyres being built and set on fire at the Altmarkt after the air raids and a document that records c6700 bodies were cremated to ashes at the Altmarkt after the air raids. Any suggestion the two are not connected needs to be evidenced. I doubt the claim of burning to ashes. The document here states;
"In consideration of the rapidly advancing decomposition and the existing extraordinary difficulties with the rescue, as well as the lack of suitable vehicles for the transfer to cemeteries with the approval of the Gauleiter and the city administration on the Altmarkt a total of 6,865 dead cremated. The ashes of the fallen were transferred to a cemetery."
We do not know exactly what condition the "ashes of the fallen" were in. It is clearly just a phrase, rather than a precise descriptive and could easily be referring to the charred remains of those who had been cremated.
I believe people were cremated in the Altmarkt, due to the evidence.
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Agandaur
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Post by Agandaur on Dec 31, 2021 21:16:43 GMT
I believe people were cremated in the Altmarkt, due to the evidence. If charring is considered cremation then I guess so. The idea of course is to prevent disease so charring would do, a slow burn over a good period of time should cook off the flesh. Still needs a good quantity of fuel. Cattle cremations involves using straw or hay which kills the disease. Rest of the beast is thrown into a rather large ditch. |
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Jan 1, 2022 9:11:22 GMT
Unevidenced assertions are being made that the Dresden pyres were not used to cremate bodies. Come back when you have evidence as to what they were used for. This section of the forum requires evidence to be presented with every claim made.
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Jan 3, 2022 3:12:11 GMT
Unevidenced assertions are being made that the Dresden pyres were not used to cremate bodies. Come back when you have evidence as to what they were used for. This section of the forum requires evidence to be presented with every claim made. In that case, let's see your evidence that the pile of bodies in the Altmarkt is connected to the document about cremations. |
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Jan 3, 2022 9:13:13 GMT
Unevidenced assertions are being made that the Dresden pyres were not used to cremate bodies. Come back when you have evidence as to what they were used for. This section of the forum requires evidence to be presented with every claim made. In that case, let's see your evidence that the pile of bodies in the Altmarkt is connected to the document about cremations. I have already shown you the evidence.
The document is above cremations in the Altmarkt in Dresden after the air raid.
The photos are of pyres in the Altmarkt in Dresden after the air raid.
The photos and document are from the same time, same place and are both about cremations.
How many times do you need to shown the same thing?
Where is your evidence the photos and document are not connected?
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Jan 3, 2022 11:40:52 GMT
Nessie wrote:
Nope, you gave your opinion. There is no direct connection between the document stating that bodies were cremated and the bodies shown in the photos. You are claiming that Occam's razor shows that the two are connected. My opinion is that Occam's razor shows that the photos of smoking bodies and the pile of cadavers showing a limited amount of flame are forgeries. Both are opinions. Take your pick.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Jan 3, 2022 14:27:26 GMT
Nessie wrote: Nope, you gave your opinion. There is no direct connection between the document stating that bodies were cremated and the bodies shown in the photos. You are claiming that Occam's razor shows that the two are connected. My opinion is that Occam's razor shows that the photos of smoking bodies and the pile of cadavers showing a limited amount of flame are forgeries. Both are opinions. Take your pick. It is not an opinion that the photos and document
- are from the Altmarkt in Dresden.
- are about the period in time shorty after the air raid on the city in 1945. - are of or about cremations.
Your opinion the photos are forgeries is you thinking up excuses to dismiss evidence that is contrary to your desired belief.
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Post by been_there on Jan 3, 2022 15:34:55 GMT
Nope, you gave your opinion. There is no direct connection between the document stating that bodies were cremated and the bodies shown in the photos. You are claiming that Occam's razor shows that the two are connected. My opinion is that Occam's razor shows that the photos of smoking bodies and the pile of cadavers showing a limited amount of flame are forgeries. Both are opinions. Take your pick.
Your opinion the photos are forgeries is you thinking up excuses to dismiss evidence that is contrary to your desired belief.
The photos in colour could very well have been tampered with to show flames . That is not expressing an opinion but stating a fact of possibility, plus one of high probability. The problem with discussing with this person is his argument is logically inconsistent, frequently does complete u-turns whilst still maintaining it to be correct, and โ as here โ does not even comprehend simple word definitions. |
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