Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 11, 2021 19:53:24 GMT
Here is a link to documents found by Jean-Claude Pressac, when he researched the gas chamber claims, at the A-B Construction Offices, that reference the construction of gas chambers inside the Kremas in 1943. The construction and design work was by the German company Topf & Sons, whose engineers gave evidence that they knew the gas chambers were to gas people.
- Memo from Fritz Sander of 17 February 1943 on โthe gas cellarโ in crematorium 2 [Schรผle, Industrie und Holocaust, p. 456, back-up 1st and 2nd page] - Order of 13 February 1943 on โ12 gas tight doors approx. 30/40โ for crematorium 4 and 5 [Pressac, Technique, p. 444] - Order of 15 February 1943 on โ210 anchors for gas tight doorsโ for crematorium 4 [Pressac, Technique, p. 448] - Order of 19 February 1943 on โ4 tight doorsโ for crematorium 4 [Pressac, Technique, p. 452] - List of materials of 24 February 1943 on โ12 gas tight doors approx. 30/40โ for crematorium 4 and 5 [Pressac, Technique, p. 444] - Delivery note of 24 February 1943 on โfittings of 12 gas tight doorsโ for crematorium 4 and 5 [Pressac, Technique, p. 443] - Work time sheet of 28 February 1943 on โfit gas tight windowsโ in crematorium 4 [Pressac, Technique, p. 445] - Work time sheet of 2 March 1943 on โconcrete in gas chamberโ in crematorium 4 [Pressac, Technique, p. 446] - Letter from Topf to central construction office Auschwitz of 2 March 1943 on โdisplay devices for hydrogen cyanide residuesโ for crematorium 2 [Pressac, Die Krematorien von Auschwitz, p. 92] - Order of 5 March 1943 of โhandle for gas doorโ for crematorium 2 [Pressac, Technique, p. 433] - Order from Karl Bischoff of 31 March 1943 on โ3 gas tight doorsโ of crematorium 4 and 5 and โgas door 100/192 for corpse cellar 1โฆwith double 8 mm glass and peepholeโ of crematorium 2 and 3 [Pressac, Technique, p. 436] - Transfer document of 31 March 1943 on โgas doorโ in crematorium 2 [Pressac, Technique, p. 437] - Order of 6 April 1943 on โ24 anchor bolts for gas tight doorsโ for crematorium 4 and 5 [Pressac, Technique, p. 454] - Material list of 13 April 1943 on โextension of the aeration and deaeration device (warm air supply) of the crematorium IIโ [Rudolf Report, 2nd edition] - Order of 16 April 1943 on โiron for fittings for 5 gas doorsโ for crematorium 4 and 5 [Pressac, Technique, p. 438] - Order of 16 April 1943 on โfitting for 1 gas doorโ for crematorium 3 [Pressac, Technique, p. 439] - Work time sheet of 16 April 1943 on โfit gas doorโ in crematorium 5 [Pressac, Technique, p. 454] - Transfer inventory of 24 June 1943 on โ14 showersโ and โ1 gas tight doorโ in crematorium 3 [Pressac, Technique , p. 430]
A number of the documents are from Topf & Sons engineers, who, when questioned, admitted that they knew the gas chambers were being built to gas people;
Kurt Pruefer "Question: Did you know that in the gas chambers and crematoria an extermination of completely innocent people was carried out? Answer: Since the spring of 1943 I knew that at Auschwitz concentration camp completely innocent people were destroyed and their corpses then burned in the crematorium. Question: What did Schultze Karl tell you about the corpses that you saw lying at the crematorium? Answer: At that time, in the spring of 1943 in the morning in the crematorium, Schultze told me regarding the corpses of up to sixty men, women and children lying there, that they had been murdered in gas chambers. Question: What equipment for the gas chambers did the company Topf design? Answer: The gas chamber was initially called ยซroom for corpsesยป, where a ventilation was installed by the company Topf, but later it became clear that this was a gas chamber for killing people. ....
Question: Were the crematoria tested during your stay at Auschwitz concentration camp? Answer: Of the six times on which I visited Auschwitz concentration camp only once, at the beginning of 1943, the testing of two of the five new ovens installed in the crematorium which had been built by myself, was carried out. In all of them six corpses of men of various ages were burnt, and there in the crematorium also lay the corpses of women and children, who had been murdered in the gas chamber and were to be burned in the crematorium. The total number of corpses was about sixty."
Karl Schultze "Question: What did your notice at the time of your stay in Auschwitz concentration camp, while you were in the immediate surroundings of the crematorium and the gas chambers? Answer: When I was at Auschwitz concentration camp, I personally saw, twenty steps away from me, how SS-men from the camp chased up to three hundred people before them - men, women and children. Of which nationality they were I could hardly determine, but according to their outside appearance they had no idea where they were being led. They chased them all into a huge wooden barracks without windows, which was electrically lighted inside. From the outside this barracks was connected with the gas chamber through a closed corridor, where I installed the ventilation. This I watched at around 16 hours. On the following day I was in the crematorium and saw sixty corpses of men, women and children of different age lying there. They lay on the floor without clothes, to be introduced into the crematorium oven. According to their aspect they had been murdered in the gas chamber."
Fritz Sander "Question: What did Prรผfer and Schultze tell you after their business trip to Auschwitz concentration camp? Answer: In the summer of 1942 Prรผfer and Schultze told me that in the concentration camps [plural] of Auschwitz they destroyed many people in gas chambers and burned their corpses in the crematoria [Plural], the burden on the crematoria being so huge that they put three corpses into an oven opening [at the same time]. Question: Does this mean you knew that in the concentration camps [plural] at Auschwitz they destroyed completely innocent people? Answer: Yes, since the summer of 1942 I knew that in the concentration camp at Auschwitz wholly innocent people were destroyed there, whereupon their bodies (plural) were burned in the crematoria [plural]. Prรผfer told me about colossal transports of people being taken from Poland, Greece and other countries to the concentration camps Auschwitz and destroyed there."
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Post by Tribunus Laticlavius on Nov 11, 2021 20:04:46 GMT
Thank you for the information Nessie, you can always refer to this as a link instead of repeating it. These are of course morgues or Leichenkeller which in your opinion (and others) have been adapted for use to murder people by gas. I guess a morgue is a good a place to die as any other.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 11, 2021 20:53:02 GMT
....These are of course morgues or Leichenkeller which in your opinion (and others) have been adapted for use to murder people by gas. .... It is not opinion, it is evidenced by multiple documents and witnesses. Gas chambers to kill people were constructed in the Birkenau Kremas in 1943.
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Post by Tribunus Laticlavius on Nov 11, 2021 21:13:25 GMT
It is an opinion. What is considered evidence is how people interpret the documents and witness statements; without human interpretation such documents etc have no value. The fact that the documents could be interpreted in a different way is really a matter of perception. People with a bias may interpret them one way, independent people, or those in the "know" would perceive them quite differently. The witness are irrelevant due to their total lack of credibility. The Birkenau Kremas were Leichenkellers (morgues) as seen in the following blue print.  Leichenkellers Birkenau
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 11, 2021 21:25:25 GMT
No, documents and witness statements are evidence. The documents clearly state that gas chambers were constructed inside the Kremas. The Topf & Sons engineers do not lack credibility. They were at the Kremas in 1943 and knew what was being done there. The documents and witnesses prove that the purpose of the building was altered so that they could be used to gas people.
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Post by been_there on Nov 12, 2021 8:20:00 GMT
....These are of course morgues or Leichenkeller which in your opinion (and others) have been adapted for use to murder people by gas. .... It is not opinion, it is evidenced by multiple documents and witnesses. Gas chambers to kill people were constructed in the Birkenau Kremas in 1943. Further proof we are plagued by an ignoramus of low intelligence. In another topic-thread he stupidly concludes that evidence of mass transports is โproofโ of mass exterminations. ๐ Now here he idiotically concludes that installation of gas-tight doors on morgues is also proof of the same. ๐คฆโโ๏ธ๐คช We are dealing with a person who does not know the difference between an opinion and a fact yet deceitfully claims to have an MA in history and to have worked as a criminal detective! BACK TO REALITY: A genuine, highly qualified academic wrote a book arguing against this belief regarding gas-tight doors at Majdanek and Auschwitz camps. He argued they were installed to allow buildings to be used as bomb-shelters and as protection against enemy use of mustard gas. You can read it here: www.samuelcrowell.com/?page_id=7Discussing the "regular" doors made gas-tight following the concept of engineers Nowak and Rademacher, Crowell wrote: And Carl Mattagno has a different view. Part of which can be read here: vho.org/GB/c/CM/Crowell-final-eng.htmlAn article refuting Crowell by Carlo Mottagno can be read here: MORGUE CELLARS OF BIRKENAU: GAS SHELTERS OR DISINFESTING CHAMBERS? by Carlo Mattogno vho.org/GB/c/CM/leichen.htmlAs will be seen from this, the actual details are the subject of considerable learned debate and are open to numerous interpretations even within revisionist circles. Yet here is a person who claims their ill-informed, ignorant, biased opinion is absolute and irrefutable factual evidence! ๐ฎ SUMMARY: We are dealing with a dishonest person of extremely low intelligence โ who appears to have lied about his qualifications and career experience โ and can not even discern the simple distinction between what is an interpretation (opinion) and what is a fact!
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Post by been_there on Nov 12, 2021 8:25:33 GMT
Bomb shelters in Birkenau: a reappraisal
by Samuel Crowell Published: 2000-06-05
Introduction A few years ago the argument began to emerge that the various gastight fixtures of the Birkenau crematoria were best explained in terms of protection against chemical warfare. The first exploration in this area was by Arthur R. Butz of Northwestern University, whose "Vergasungskeller" article of July 1996 argued that the basement spaces of Crematoria II and III at Birkenau were equipped in a manner consistent with an anti-chemical warfare "gas shelter." In the spring of 1997, our own research led to the article "Technique and Operation of German Anti-Gas Shelters in World War Two" (hereinafter, Technique), which approached the issue of chemical warfare defense from an air raid protection point of view, supporting the argument with many references to contemporary German civil air defense literature. Technique expanded the argument for gas protection considerably, but also created a link between chemical warfare protection and air raid protection because it showed that chemical warfare protection was intrinsic to German bomb shelter design: that is, all bomb shelters were meant to provide gas protection, and gas shelters were essentially a subset of bomb shelters. It should be said that the argument in Technique was not meant to be comprehensive but merely to alert interested students to the possibilities of German civil air defense literature in explaining the origin and purpose of the gastight fixtures of the Birkenau crematoria. Hence, the article consisted of a simple comparison of only two data sets: the German civil air defense literature on the one hand, and the so-called Criminal Traces of J. C. Pressac on the other. Of course, the idea that the crematoria of Birkenau would be equipped to protect against bombs or poison gas is unusual, but it was a conclusion that seemed to us inevitable, given the essential identity of all of the gastight fixtures noted by Pressac and ordinary civil air defense paraphernalia found in the German literature. For this reason, we thought it important to put the matter before the public. At the same time, however, the idea was unusual enough that it seemed to call for further investigation, and hence a sister article, "Defending Against the Allied Bombing Campaign" (Defending) followed in July of 1997. The primary aim of Defending was simply to investigate whether the gastight fixtures common in the German civil air defense literature were also common in Germany during the war. The secondary aim of Defending was to see if there was any other evidence of bomb shelters or gas shelters in the concentration camps, and particularly in Auschwitz. The main limitation of Defending was that at the time we had no documents proving the existence of gastight bomb shelters in either the concentration camps, or at Auschwitz, and in the meantime we were constantly being assured from all sides that there had never been any. Technique and Defending, along with Professor Butz' prior article, became the basis for what was essentially a new model for explaining the gastight fixtures at Auschwitz. For many years, the existence of gastight fixtures at Auschwitz had been assumed as references to homicidal gas chambers, while since the late 1970's the standard antithesis was that these gastight references were all references to delousing or disinfection gas chambers. We may call these the "gas chamber thesis" and the "disinfection thesis" respectively. (See NOTE) The new emphasis on protection against poison gas in an air raid context, however, provided a third model, what we have called the "bomb shelter thesis." We would define the bomb shelter thesis in this way: there are a number of objects, fixtures, and names applied to spaces in the Birkenau crematoria and other buildings at Auschwitz, and most of these terms, although not all, include reference to gastightness. The bomb shelter thesis simply states that some, or many, or most, or all, of these are best explained in a civil air defense context, which includes gas protection. Like any thesis, the bomb shelter thesis has a maximum and a minimum. It may be that the thesis explains some of these gastight fixtures, but not others. It may be that it explains all of them, in which case it would seem to follow that the gastight fixtures of the Birkenau crematoria were applied to those buildings with the intent of following civil air defense or gas protection guidelines, and not for purposes of mass gassing or disinfection. The only way to test the thesis would be for the various experts in this field to apply the civil air defense model to the existing evidence, and for that reason our writings on the subject have sometimes challenged these experts. In the event, however the experts have been disinclined to pursue the thesis at all. In early 1998, we received copies of three documents from the Auschwitz Central Construction Office, which are today archived in Moscow, and these proved that the camp was involved in air raid protection measures a full year earlier than had previously been believed (Auschwitz Central Construction Office = Zentralbauleitung der Waffen-SS und Polizei Auschwitz = ZBL). These documents, along with a brief letter which outlined our proposed interpretation of them, with, it must be admitted, a certain challenging and unguarded tone, were published on the Internet website of the British historian David Irving (see Documents). Shortly before, Technique was published by the German scientist Germar Rudolf in his revisionist journal, Viertelsjahrhefte fรผr freie Geschichtsforschung. A year later, in early 1999, Herr Rudolf's translation of Technique was subjected to a critique by the Italian revisionist Carlo Mattogno, himself an apostle of the disinfection thesis. This called forth a rather brief rebuttal from us, (see Comments), which a few months later led to a further critique by Mattogno. Finally, in early 2000, the bomb shelter thesis was discussed in some detail by Professor Robert Jan van Pelt in his expert report for the David Irving v. Deborah Lipstadt/Penguin libel trial. This came shortly after the Journal of Historical Review had published another adaptation of Technique, this time in Mark Weber's version. In the meantime, during the Irving v. Lipstadt trial, David Irving adopted a limited acceptance of the bomb shelter thesis with regard to the gastight fixtures of Crematoria II and III, and the thesis was the subject of testimony by Irving and van Pelt, was referred to in the closing speeches of both Irving and Richard Rampton QC, and was discussed in the judgment of Justice Charles Gray. It may be fairly said that the thesis is beginning to be discussed more widely, and therefore is deserving of review. The purpose of the present study is to review the evidence for bomb shelters and the application of civil air defense procedures in the Auschwitz-Birkenau complex, based primarily on documents from the Auschwitz Central Construction Office. We do not mean to rewrite or rehash the content of either Technique or Defending, but simply to supplement these articles with other information that has come to our attention over the past three years. In the course of doing so, we will have an opportunity to reappraise our interpretation of the Criminal Traces and answer the critical objections of Mattogno and van Pelt. In Part One we will describe the background to the argument, which essentially turns on the presentation of documentary evidence that the Birkenau crematoria were adapted for the purposes of mass murder with poison gas. Here we will briefly cover the documentary situation from the time of the Nuremberg trials through the writing of our own articles in 1997. In Part Two, preceded by a brief survey of documents for occupied Poland, we will present several documents, many of them from the Central Construction Office of Auschwitz, which will show that Auschwitz was in receipt of civil air defense directives from the beginning of the camp's existence. We will also see that certain evidence for the implementation of civil air defense procedures comes from the summer of 1943. In Part Three, we will review the Criminal Traces of J. C. Pressac, and make some expansions and some concessions as to the proper interpretation of some of these documentary references. In addition, we will offer a few new documents. In Part Four, we will array a few dozen documents, nearly all of them from the archives of the Central Construction Office, and nearly all of them unearthed by revisionist researchers in the past few years. We will attempt to arrange these documents into a coherent narrative that supports the disinfection thesis, and after, to point up the deficiencies of the gas chamber thesis in explaining these documents. In Part Five, we will review the criticisms of Mattogno and van Pelt and provide our responses to them. Our overall conclusion is that the crematoria in Birkenau ended up fulfilling three functions. First, they were built to implement the special measures dictated by General Kammler of the SS Construction Office in Berlin with respect to improving the hygienic conditions in the camp by providing crematoria that would allow for the rapid disposal of the dead. Second, the showers, washing facilities, and other facilities with which the crematoria were equipped were to be used temporarily for the showering of the prisoners, and the disinfection of their garments, prior to the completion of the Central Sauna at the end of 1943 and the main Reception Center in the main camp in 1944. Finally, like all new constructions and particularly those equipped with showers or other washing facilities, the crematoria were also equipped with various gastight equipment in order to fulfill civil air defense requirements, including those for chemical warfare decontamination, in accordance with a further set of directives from General Kammler. The evidence suggests that the early adherence to civil air defense guidelines was something of a formality, but that by early 1944 the matter of adequate civil air protection in the Auschwitz-Birkenau camp became a pressing concern, and continued on until the liberation of the camp in early 1945. In short, we will see that the documentary and material evidence, at all levels, indicates concern over civil air defense and gas protection in the Auschwitz camp that increases probably from the fall of 1942 until the end of the camp's operation. This involved, by early 1944, the proliferation of gastight fixtures, and other fixtures, identical to the gastight fixtures with which the Birkenau crematoria were equipped the previous spring. The deficiencies of the alternative explanations will be noted, and the bomb shelter thesis will be argued as the most plausible explanation for the gastight fixtures of the crematoria. codoh.com/library/document/bomb-shelters-in-birkenau-a-reappraisal/en/
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 12, 2021 9:38:06 GMT
It is not opinion, it is evidenced by multiple documents and witnesses. Gas chambers to kill people were constructed in the Birkenau Kremas in 1943. Further proof we are plagued by an ignoramus of low intelligence. In another topic-thread he stupidly concludes that evidence of mass transports is โproofโ of mass exterminations. ๐ Not proof, evidence of. Not proof, evidence of. I can tell the difference between opinion, logical fallacies and evidence. Crowell, Butz and Mattogno's claims that the gas chmabers inside the Kremas were variously built to function as showers, bomb shelters and for delousing, are not backed by any other evidence from inside the Kremas. The gassing of people is backed by every single witness and the circumstantial evidence of mass arrivals, selections and those not selected for work being sent to the Kremas, where there were mass cremations and all of their property was stolen and used by the Nazis. That you subject me to constant personal attacks is contrary to forum rules, and it evidences you know your claims are weak.
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Nessie
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๐๐๐ง๐๐ซ๐๐๐ข๐ฅ๐ข๐ฌ ๐ฎ๐ฑ๐ท๐๐ฑ๐ถ๐ฐ๐ฎ๐๐ผ๐ฟ (Nessies forum)
Posts: 4,828
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Post by Nessie on Nov 12, 2021 9:42:15 GMT
Bomb shelters in Birkenau: a reappraisal
by Samuel Crowell Published: 2000-06-05
Introduction A few years ago the argument began to emerge that the various gastight fixtures of the Birkenau crematoria were best explained in terms of protection against chemical warfare. The first exploration in this area was by Arthur R. Butz of Northwestern University, whose "Vergasungskeller" article of July 1996 argued that the basement spaces of Crematoria II and III at Birkenau were equipped in a manner consistent with an anti-chemical warfare "gas shelter." In the spring of 1997, our own research led to the article "Technique and Operation of German Anti-Gas Shelters in World War Two" (hereinafter, Technique), which approached the issue of chemical warfare defense from an air raid protection point of view, supporting the argument with many references to contemporary German civil air defense literature. Technique expanded the argument for gas protection considerably, but also created a link between chemical warfare protection and air raid protection because it showed that chemical warfare protection was intrinsic to German bomb shelter design: that is, all bomb shelters were meant to provide gas protection, and gas shelters were essentially a subset of bomb shelters. It should be said that the argument in Technique was not meant to be comprehensive but merely to alert interested students to the possibilities of German civil air defense literature in explaining the origin and purpose of the gastight fixtures of the Birkenau crematoria. Hence, the article consisted of a simple comparison of only two data sets: the German civil air defense literature on the one hand, and the so-called Criminal Traces of J. C. Pressac on the other. Of course, the idea that the crematoria of Birkenau would be equipped to protect against bombs or poison gas is unusual, but it was a conclusion that seemed to us inevitable, given the essential identity of all of the gastight fixtures noted by Pressac and ordinary civil air defense paraphernalia found in the German literature. For this reason, we thought it important to put the matter before the public. At the same time, however, the idea was unusual enough that it seemed to call for further investigation, and hence a sister article, "Defending Against the Allied Bombing Campaign" (Defending) followed in July of 1997. The primary aim of Defending was simply to investigate whether the gastight fixtures common in the German civil air defense literature were also common in Germany during the war. The secondary aim of Defending was to see if there was any other evidence of bomb shelters or gas shelters in the concentration camps, and particularly in Auschwitz. The main limitation of Defending was that at the time we had no documents proving the existence of gastight bomb shelters in either the concentration camps, or at Auschwitz, and in the meantime we were constantly being assured from all sides that there had never been any. Technique and Defending, along with Professor Butz' prior article, became the basis for what was essentially a new model for explaining the gastight fixtures at Auschwitz. For many years, the existence of gastight fixtures at Auschwitz had been assumed as references to homicidal gas chambers, while since the late 1970's the standard antithesis was that these gastight references were all references to delousing or disinfection gas chambers. We may call these the "gas chamber thesis" and the "disinfection thesis" respectively. (See NOTE) The new emphasis on protection against poison gas in an air raid context, however, provided a third model, what we have called the "bomb shelter thesis." We would define the bomb shelter thesis in this way: there are a number of objects, fixtures, and names applied to spaces in the Birkenau crematoria and other buildings at Auschwitz, and most of these terms, although not all, include reference to gastightness. The bomb shelter thesis simply states that some, or many, or most, or all, of these are best explained in a civil air defense context, which includes gas protection. Like any thesis, the bomb shelter thesis has a maximum and a minimum. It may be that the thesis explains some of these gastight fixtures, but not others. It may be that it explains all of them, in which case it would seem to follow that the gastight fixtures of the Birkenau crematoria were applied to those buildings with the intent of following civil air defense or gas protection guidelines, and not for purposes of mass gassing or disinfection. The only way to test the thesis would be for the various experts in this field to apply the civil air defense model to the existing evidence, and for that reason our writings on the subject have sometimes challenged these experts. In the event, however the experts have been disinclined to pursue the thesis at all. In early 1998, we received copies of three documents from the Auschwitz Central Construction Office, which are today archived in Moscow, and these proved that the camp was involved in air raid protection measures a full year earlier than had previously been believed (Auschwitz Central Construction Office = Zentralbauleitung der Waffen-SS und Polizei Auschwitz = ZBL). These documents, along with a brief letter which outlined our proposed interpretation of them, with, it must be admitted, a certain challenging and unguarded tone, were published on the Internet website of the British historian David Irving (see Documents). Shortly before, Technique was published by the German scientist Germar Rudolf in his revisionist journal, Viertelsjahrhefte fรผr freie Geschichtsforschung. A year later, in early 1999, Herr Rudolf's translation of Technique was subjected to a critique by the Italian revisionist Carlo Mattogno, himself an apostle of the disinfection thesis. This called forth a rather brief rebuttal from us, (see Comments), which a few months later led to a further critique by Mattogno. Finally, in early 2000, the bomb shelter thesis was discussed in some detail by Professor Robert Jan van Pelt in his expert report for the David Irving v. Deborah Lipstadt/Penguin libel trial. This came shortly after the Journal of Historical Review had published another adaptation of Technique, this time in Mark Weber's version. In the meantime, during the Irving v. Lipstadt trial, David Irving adopted a limited acceptance of the bomb shelter thesis with regard to the gastight fixtures of Crematoria II and III, and the thesis was the subject of testimony by Irving and van Pelt, was referred to in the closing speeches of both Irving and Richard Rampton QC, and was discussed in the judgment of Justice Charles Gray. It may be fairly said that the thesis is beginning to be discussed more widely, and therefore is deserving of review. The purpose of the present study is to review the evidence for bomb shelters and the application of civil air defense procedures in the Auschwitz-Birkenau complex, based primarily on documents from the Auschwitz Central Construction Office. We do not mean to rewrite or rehash the content of either Technique or Defending, but simply to supplement these articles with other information that has come to our attention over the past three years. In the course of doing so, we will have an opportunity to reappraise our interpretation of the Criminal Traces and answer the critical objections of Mattogno and van Pelt. In Part One we will describe the background to the argument, which essentially turns on the presentation of documentary evidence that the Birkenau crematoria were adapted for the purposes of mass murder with poison gas. Here we will briefly cover the documentary situation from the time of the Nuremberg trials through the writing of our own articles in 1997. In Part Two, preceded by a brief survey of documents for occupied Poland, we will present several documents, many of them from the Central Construction Office of Auschwitz, which will show that Auschwitz was in receipt of civil air defense directives from the beginning of the camp's existence. We will also see that certain evidence for the implementation of civil air defense procedures comes from the summer of 1943. In Part Three, we will review the Criminal Traces of J. C. Pressac, and make some expansions and some concessions as to the proper interpretation of some of these documentary references. In addition, we will offer a few new documents. In Part Four, we will array a few dozen documents, nearly all of them from the archives of the Central Construction Office, and nearly all of them unearthed by revisionist researchers in the past few years. We will attempt to arrange these documents into a coherent narrative that supports the disinfection thesis, and after, to point up the deficiencies of the gas chamber thesis in explaining these documents. In Part Five, we will review the criticisms of Mattogno and van Pelt and provide our responses to them. Our overall conclusion is that the crematoria in Birkenau ended up fulfilling three functions. First, they were built to implement the special measures dictated by General Kammler of the SS Construction Office in Berlin with respect to improving the hygienic conditions in the camp by providing crematoria that would allow for the rapid disposal of the dead. Second, the showers, washing facilities, and other facilities with which the crematoria were equipped were to be used temporarily for the showering of the prisoners, and the disinfection of their garments, prior to the completion of the Central Sauna at the end of 1943 and the main Reception Center in the main camp in 1944. Finally, like all new constructions and particularly those equipped with showers or other washing facilities, the crematoria were also equipped with various gastight equipment in order to fulfill civil air defense requirements, including those for chemical warfare decontamination, in accordance with a further set of directives from General Kammler. The evidence suggests that the early adherence to civil air defense guidelines was something of a formality, but that by early 1944 the matter of adequate civil air protection in the Auschwitz-Birkenau camp became a pressing concern, and continued on until the liberation of the camp in early 1945. In short, we will see that the documentary and material evidence, at all levels, indicates concern over civil air defense and gas protection in the Auschwitz camp that increases probably from the fall of 1942 until the end of the camp's operation. This involved, by early 1944, the proliferation of gastight fixtures, and other fixtures, identical to the gastight fixtures with which the Birkenau crematoria were equipped the previous spring. The deficiencies of the alternative explanations will be noted, and the bomb shelter thesis will be argued as the most plausible explanation for the gastight fixtures of the crematoria. codoh.com/library/document/bomb-shelters-in-birkenau-a-reappraisal/en/Why do the construction office documents regularly use the word gas, when referring to the construction of gassing cellers/chambers inside the Kremas? Why does no constructiondocument use the German words for bomb shelter, showers or delousing chamber? If that iw what they were building, why not use those descriptives?
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Post by been_there on Nov 12, 2021 10:21:26 GMT
....These are of course morgues or Leichenkeller which in your opinion (and others) have been adapted for use to murder people by gas. .... It is not opinion, it is evidenced by multiple documents and witnesses. Gas chambers to kill people were constructed in the Birkenau Kremas in 1943. This is such an extremely STUPID person, that I feel it is worth pointing out that stupidity so that readers unfamiliar with him and the complexity of the subject matter do not regard his asinine comments as worthy of serious consideration. I therefore argue that is not a contradiction of forum rules but a legitimate response to a constant flow of self-contradictory and literally idiotic comments. Not only has this person shown they cannot distinguish between an opinion and a fact, but they are now denying that they just equated โevidence forโ as โproof ofโ. See the above comment where they just did exactly that. Yet now, within 24 hours they are denying they claimed that. Therefore what kind of serious discussion can be had with such an ignorant, dishonest and unreasonable person?
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 12, 2021 18:35:44 GMT
Been-there, if the Kremas were being modified so that showering, delousing or use as bomb shelters was the plan, why does no document contain the words "Dusche", "Duschen","Entlausung" or "Luftschutzbunker"?
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Agandaur
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Post by Agandaur on Nov 12, 2021 18:44:29 GMT
Been-there, if the Kremas were being modified so that showering, delousing or use as bomb shelters was the plan, why does no document contain the words "Dusche", "Duschen","Entlausung" or "Luftschutzbunker"? I am sure the wording or lack of it fails as evidence for mass extermination.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 12, 2021 19:58:02 GMT
Been-there, if the Kremas were being modified so that showering, delousing or use as bomb shelters was the plan, why does no document contain the words "Dusche", "Duschen","Entlausung" or "Luftschutzbunker"? I am sure the wording or lack of it fails as evidence for mass extermination. The wording mean that the claims made about alternative uses for the kremas are undermined.
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Post by Tribunus Laticlavius on Nov 13, 2021 6:47:27 GMT
The wording mean that the claims made about alternative uses for the kremas are undermined. This poster is suggesting that because a morgue does not have signs written, "Shower", "Showers", "Delousing" or "Air raid shelter"?, this some how confirms this was not a morgue. I wonder how many of the inhabitants of this place would be in a fit state to read. I feel that their eyes are firmly shut.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 20, 2021 20:26:17 GMT
The wording mean that the claims made about alternative uses for the kremas are undermined. This poster is suggesting that because a morgue does not have signs written, "Shower", "Showers", "Delousing" or "Air raid shelter"?, this some how confirms this was not a morgue. I wonder how many of the inhabitants of this place would be in a fit state to read. I feel that their eyes are firmly shut. It is clearly significant, in establishing what took place inside the Kremas, that no document uses the terms suggested. The documents are clear, the Kremas were modified to contain gas chambers and significantly, undressing rooms;
- Letter from Eduard Wirths of 21 January 1943 on โundressing roomโ in crematorium 2 [Mattogno ATCOS, vol. 1, p. 72]
- Letter from Karl Bischoff to Topf of 6 March 1943 on โpreheating cellar 1โ and โundressing roomโ in crematorium 2 and 3 [Pressac, Technique, p. 433] - Working time sheet from Heinrich Messing of 14 March 1943 on โundressing cellar 2โ in crematorium 2 [Pressac, Technique, p. 434] - Work time sheet from Heinrich Messing of 13 April 1943 on โundressing cellarโ in crematorium 3 [Pressac, Technique, p. 439]
Add to that the Sonderkommando photo of people undressing outside Krema V;
The evidence converges, people were stripped before they were gassed.
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