Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 21, 2021 13:24:46 GMT
There are statements from credible witnesses that there were mass transports of Jews from T-II. Nessie claims that these witnesses are the only witnesses but in fact their statements are the only ones recorded. The total number of deportees from T-II is unknown. On the other hand, there's NO credible witnesses to Jews being systematically murdered at T-II. Neither does any unequivocal evidence of mass murder exist. You dishonestly omit to admit that the witnesses you claim are credible, such as Helen Schwartz, all state that TII was a death camp. How is she credible, when she states the opposite of what you believe?
The total number of evidenced people who were transported from TII to work at labour camps in Poland is at most 9500;
That total assumes the likes of Helen Schwartz is correct, and she was transported from Majdanek to TII, where she spent a few days hiding in the latrines and doing no work, before being selected for work and taken to Blishjen camp to sort clothing.
If you claim she is credible, then you are admitting TII was a death camp, as she said "We exited and realized that they had brought us to Treblinka. This turned out to be the worst of the worst concentration camp in history. So many Jews were killed in this horrific place..."
How is she a credible witness to what happened at TII?
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Post by been_there on Nov 21, 2021 16:49:51 GMT
There are statements from credible witnesses that there were mass transports of Jews from T-II. Nessie claims that these witnesses are the only witnesses but in fact their statements are the only ones recorded. The total number of deportees from T-II is unknown. On the other hand, there's NO credible witnesses to Jews being systematically murdered at T-II. Neither does any unequivocal evidence of mass murder exist. ...Helen Schwartz is correct, and she was transported from Majdanek to TII... before being selected for work and taken to Blishjen camp... ...How is she a credible witness to what happened at TII? Because if she was transited through Treblinka 2 then she is a living proof that it was NOT soley the โdeath campโ described by Wiernik and the other lie-witnesses. It was NOT the centre for ONLY โexterminationsโ that the mythology claimed for decades and which Yarad and the other liar-historians promulgated. [Holy moly! ๐คฆโโ๏ธ]If she was there and DID get transited through the camp, then the very fact of her being still alive after the war, makes her a credible witness to the TRUTH that for many Jews T2 was a โtransit campโ. [Godโs teeth! And this guy wants us to believe he has an M.A in History!?!] ๐คช |
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 21, 2021 17:02:41 GMT
...Helen Schwartz is correct, and she was transported from Majdanek to TII... before being selected for work and taken to Blishjen camp... ...How is she a credible witness to what happened at TII? Because if she was transited through Treblinka 2 then she is a living proof that it was NOT soley the โdeath campโ described by Wiernik and the other lie-witnesses. It was NOT the centre for ONLY โexterminationsโ that the mythology claimed for decades and which Yarad and the other liar-historians promulgated. [Holy moly! ๐คฆโโ๏ธ]If she was there and DID get transited through the camp, then the very fact of her being still alive after the war, makes her a credible witness to the TRUTH that for many Jews T2 was a โtransit campโ. [Godโs teeth! And this guy wants us to believe he has an M.A in History!?!] ๐คช Evidence and prove she was transited from Majdanek to TII to Blishjen and that she is remembering accurately what happened to her. You need to explain why you accept her evidence as "living proof".
Every single camp with gas chambers, had reports of selections and people being sent to work elsewhere as the other went to the gas chambers, most famously at Birkenau. Anyone, historians included, who claims everyone sent to a death camp died, is wrong. That mythology should be challenged.
How many Jews were transited through TII? Show your evidence in your answer.
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Post by Hรผntinger on Nov 21, 2021 18:08:54 GMT
Every single camp with gas chambers, had reports of selections and people being sent to work elsewhere as the other went to the gas chambers, most famously at Birkenau. Anyone, historians included, who claims everyone sent to a death camp died, is wrong. That mythology should be challenged. How many Jews were transited through TII? Show your evidence in your answer. It appears that selections of some sort were a function of every camp; it is just that some camps had gas chambers thrown into the mix depending on how the "narrative" needs modifying. On this basis one cannot correlate selections with gas chambers. This thread is NOT about Birkenau or about TII but the goings on at other claimed AR camps aka border camps, Sobibor and Belzec. |
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 21, 2021 19:08:30 GMT
... It appears that selections of some sort were a function of every camp; it is just that some camps had gas chambers thrown into the mix depending on how the "narrative" needs modifying. On this basis one cannot correlate selections with gas chambers. ... Been-there does not understand that. He thinks anyone selected means there is now evidence a camp is a transit camp. |
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nazgul
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Post by nazgul on Nov 21, 2021 19:51:01 GMT
Been-there does not understand that. He thinks anyone selected means there is now evidence a camp is a transit camp. As I see it, what some other member understands or fails to do so is not anyone's concern; if he wants clarification then he can ask for it. We all make our own interpretation about what is posted, do some fact checking and seek possible alternatives. I think it has been mentioned a few times now, every camp is in reality a transit camp except a true execution center like Czerwony bor. (if that existed). Selections could be for a huge number of reasons; this happens in the army all the time, especially when they want volunteers. Most of the selections I have read in regards to the nazi camps were to do with work placements and initially sex segregation and children. This happened in modern times at the Mexico border under the Policy of Mr Trump. This segregation is more to divide and conquer though extremely upsetting for those who were victims. |
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Post by been_there on Nov 21, 2021 20:28:41 GMT
...It appears that selections of some sort were a function of every camp; it is just that some camps had gas chambers thrown into the mix depending on how the "narrative" needs modifying. On this basis one cannot correlate selections with gas chambers. Been-there does not understand that. He thinks anyone selected means there is now evidence a camp is a transit camp. Oh boy!! ๐คฆโโ๏ธ๐ Strawman miscomprehension, yet again. Yitzhak Arad made abundantly clear in an email correspondence to Eric Hunt that the mythology he believed and promulgated was that ALL Jews transported to T2 were killed and buried there. ALL of them! None escaped it! NONE! And that was because he claimed it was there ONLY for exterminating Jews. Didnโt you know that? And most of the other lie-witnesses and Joo-ish โhistoriansโ perpetuated and published that lie until revisionists exposed the deception. Otherwise name and quote Wiernik, Rachman or any of the most high-profile โsurvivorsโ and โhistoriansโ describing anytime before the Zรผndel trial, anything coherent and non-contradictory about work selections at T2 and transits onwards of Jews. ๐ค |
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Post by ๐๐๐ฎ๐ฒ๐๐ป๐ผ๐ฑ๐ฟ๐ฟ on Nov 21, 2021 22:58:42 GMT
Yitzhak Arad made abundantly clear in an email correspondence to Eric Hunt that the mythology he believed and promulgated was that ALL Jews transported to T2 were killed and buried there. ALL of them! None escaped it! NONE! And that was because he claimed it was there ONLY for exterminating Jews. Didnโt you know that? And most of the other lie-witnesses and Joo-ish โhistoriansโ perpetuated and published that lie until revisionists exposed the deception. ๐ค This is correct; even today Holocaust.cz has the following to say: Of course Yankel Wiernik was not killed as wiki tells the world. This is quite clear except for the testimony of Marian Olszuk: and The testimony of this man is quite at odds with the description given by "official" sources. |
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 22, 2021 8:51:51 GMT
Been-there does not understand that. He thinks anyone selected means there is now evidence a camp is a transit camp. Oh boy!! ๐คฆโโ๏ธ๐ Strawman miscomprehension, yet again. Yitzhak Arad made abundantly clear in an email correspondence to Eric Hunt that the mythology he believed and promulgated was that ALL Jews transported to T2 were killed and buried there. ALL of them! None escaped it! NONE! And that was because he claimed it was there ONLY for exterminating Jews. Didnโt you know that? And most of the other lie-witnesses and Joo-ish โhistoriansโ perpetuated and published that lie until revisionists exposed the deception. Otherwise name and quote Wiernik, Rachman or any of the most high-profile โsurvivorsโ and โhistoriansโ describing anytime before the Zรผndel trial, anything coherent and non-contradictory about work selections at T2 and transits onwards of Jews. ๐ค Arad and any other historian was wrong to claim all died. It was not a lie exposed by revisionists. That people had arrived at TII and been selected top work and left to go to other Polish labour camps became known when the documentary by Claude Lanzmann "Shoah" was released in 1985. It contains some of the interviews Eric Hunt then used in his documentaries where he argued TII was a transit camp. As the USHMM and various historians interviewed more and more witnesses, more details about what had happened emerged. The study of history is an ongoing process, and when an event is as large as WWII and the Holocaust, it is going to take decades to gather evidence.
Now, most historians should know about the selections that took place at TII.
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Nessie
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Post by Nessie on Nov 22, 2021 9:02:39 GMT
Yitzhak Arad made abundantly clear in an email correspondence to Eric Hunt that the mythology he believed and promulgated was that ALL Jews transported to T2 were killed and buried there. ALL of them! None escaped it! NONE! And that was because he claimed it was there ONLY for exterminating Jews. Didnโt you know that? And most of the other lie-witnesses and Joo-ish โhistoriansโ perpetuated and published that lie until revisionists exposed the deception. ๐ค This is correct; even today Holocaust.cz has the following to say: Of course Yankel Wiernik was not killed as wiki tells the world. This is quite clear except for the testimony of Marian Olszuk: and The testimony of this man is quite at odds with the description given by "official" sources. The way different sources chose to describe what happened, and where they got their information from, is of course going to result in a variance in details. But the source you quote agrees with Wiernik, in that people were selected to work; "Jewish prisoners who worked there in carpentry, cobblers' and metal-working workshops." and with Olszuk about trading with the locals; "... collect and classify any valuables, which were then vigorously traded by Germans, Ukrainians and the local population."
As more detail has come to light about what happened inside TII, our knowledge has improved. What is important, is that no evidence has been found to back up revisionist claims about there being no gassings inside TII.
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Post by ๐๐๐ฎ๐ฒ๐๐ป๐ผ๐ฑ๐ฟ๐ฟ on Nov 22, 2021 17:20:03 GMT
The way different sources chose to describe what happened, and where they got their information from, is of course going to result in a variance in details. But the source you quote agrees with Wiernik, in that people were selected to work; "Jewish prisoners who worked there in carpentry, cobblers' and metal-working workshops." and with Olszuk about trading with the locals; "... collect and classify any valuables, which were then vigorously traded by Germans, Ukrainians and the local population." This thread is not about gassings inside TII, in fact it is not about TII but the transports to AR camps in general. The description of everyone being murdered within minutes by one set of witnesses and the description of a normal camp situation with nothing untoward by other people over an extended period is not a variance in detail but a description of parallel universes. Each description negates the other; both cannot be true. The description of Wiernik etc is that only Sonderkommando were selected to work on exterminating the rest, not, to be selected as bakers, butchers, cobblers and candestickmakers. Vasily Grossman, a witness said the following: This statement is really at some discord with Marian and others talking with guards and trading goods. Another minor variance of detail I expect. |
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Post by been_there on Dec 10, 2021 19:36:47 GMT
The Nazis claimed that over 1.4 million Jews had been deported to the โEastโ. How come not a single Jewish eyewitness of the Holocaust has ever written or spoken about those alleged transports to the East? ...I wonder whyโฆ Yeah, I wonder why no Jewish โwitnessesโ gave testimony that contradicted the โspecial-suffering, eternal-victim, โpoor usโ, emerging H-narrative. Hmmmm? Strange, that!? By the way, Raul Hilberg put the figure of Jews killed by the Einsatsgruppen at 1.4 million. Also... the initial claim for jews killed at Majdanek was 1.4 million (it later had to be reduced to 78,000). And... the claim of numbers of Jews killed in just the Ukraine is ....[wait for it]... yes, you guessed, ...it is 1.4 million.
 Then there is this from the BBC on the very convenient story of a non-credible manuscript miraculously found at Auschwitz:  Does this number perhaps have some special mythological significance for Jews, as the โ6 millionโ figure does? ๐ค |
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Venatแปr
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Post by Venatแปr on Dec 11, 2021 4:47:09 GMT
In the same report, Heinrich Himmler ordered for โspecial treatmentโ to be changed to โprocessedโ. I wonder why? Probably because "Special Treatment" could be misconstrued as euthanasia as was used with Aktion 14f13 canditates. |
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Post by goody on Dec 11, 2021 12:18:51 GMT
The Nazis claimed that over 1.4 million Jews had been deported to the โEastโ. How come not a single Jewish eyewitness of the Holocaust has ever written or spoken about those alleged transports to the East? ย ...I wonder whyโฆ Yeah, I wonder why no Jewish โwitnessesโ gave testimony that contradicted the โspecial-suffering, eternal-victim, โpoor usโ, emerging H-narrative. Hmmmm? Strange, that!? By the way, Raul Hilberg put the figure of Jews killed by the Einsatsgruppen at 1.4 million. Also... the initial claim for jews killed atย Majdanek was 1.4 million (it later had to be reduced to 78,000). And... the claim of numbers of Jews killed in just the Ukraine is ....[wait for it]... yes, you guessed, ...it isย 1.4 million.
Then there is this from the BBC on the very convenient story of a non-credible manuscript miraculously found at Auschwitz: Does this number perhaps have some special mythological significance for Jews, as the โ6 millionโ figure does? ๐ค Your lengthy post didnโt address my post at all. The revisionist narrative is that Treblinka was a transit camp and not an extermination camp, but no revisionist can explain why none of the Jews who were allegedly transited from Treblinka to the East ever wrote or spoke about that policy being carried out. To date, the best a revisionist can do is quote a few survivors of Treblinka who feature in Eric Huntโs video about Treblinka. But, any revisionist who does that is either unaware or deliberately ignoring that Hunt himself admitted that his video is misleading because the full testimonies arenโt used and that the survivors spoke about being sent to other Nazi camps to work and not to the East to be resettled and live happily ever after. And, those testimonies never spoke about what happened to the overwhelming majority of Jews who were sent to Treblinka. Hunt didnโt reveal anything new because it was revealed during the Treblinka Trials over half a century ago that a small number of Jews were selected to work in other camps. What happened to the Jewish children? What happened to the Jews who couldnโt work? Eric Hunt asked Friedrich Berg those questions and the latter just said that he didnโt care and that it wasnโt importantโฆ he just avoided answering those questions. What youโre doing is a typical revisionist tactic - you avoid answering any questions and just post irrelevant nonsense. How about you try answering my very simple question? If your opinion is that Treblinka wasnโt an extermination camp, what did happen to the Jews who were sent there? No Nazi, guard, etc, who worked at the camp ever tried to use the claim that it was a transit camp in his defence during any trial, why was that? Itโs an invention made by revisionists in the 1980s that it was a transit camp. Then it became pedalled by the same people online. With all of the available information, so why can no revisionist actually answer it? |
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Turnagain
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Post by Turnagain on Dec 11, 2021 12:42:11 GMT
Probably because "Special Treatment" could be misconstrued as euthanasia as was used with Aktion 14f13 canditates. It wasnโt just used for that purpose. It was a well known euphemism for mass murder. In that case show us some lab tested cremains for those who were "mass murdered". Throw in some GPR scans for those giant graves while you're at it. |
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