DEBATE between Eric Hunt & Friedrich Paul Berg

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Scott
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Re: DEBATE between Eric Hunt & Friedrich Paul Berg

Post by Scott » Fri May 04, 2018 1:49 am

Nessie wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 5:06 am
Scott wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 6:31 pm
......

After World War II, during the Hostages Trial,[9] the seventh of the Nuremberg Trials, the tribunal found that, on the question of partisans, according to the then-current laws of war, the partisan fighters in southeast Europe could not be considered lawful belligerents under Article 1 of the Hague Convention. [10] In relation to Wilhelm List, the tribunal stated:

We are obliged to hold that such guerrillas were francs tireurs who, upon capture, could be subjected to the death penalty. Consequently, no criminal responsibility attaches to the defendant List because of the execution of captured partisans... [10]

The post-war Geneva Convention established new protocols; according to Article 4 of the Third Geneva Convention of 1949, francs-tireurs are entitled to prisoner-of-war status provided that they are commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates, have a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance, carry arms openly, and conduct their operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war. [Emphases added.]

/wiki/Francs-tireurs


I am not sure if you are trolling or genuinely struggling with the concept.

It is not me who is struggling. You claimed "Whatever they are called, under the Hague and Geneva international agreements (treaties) they are Illegal Combatants...." when I referenced civilians who fight back. That was wrong.

You have since moved the goalposts to irregular military and partisans. I accept that where a defeated and occupied country is able to organise those with military training, soldiers who avoided capture etc, those have been defined as illegal combatants.


In other words, you didn't know what you were talking about.

But--to give you the benefit of a doubt--since you had Germans or Nazis in mind, you thought that it was nothing just for civilians to open up on them with impunity.

:roll:

“Now we have forced Hitler to war so he no longer can peacefully annihilate one piece of the Treaty of Versailles after the other.”
~ Major General J.F.C. Fuller,
historian – England

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Re: DEBATE between Eric Hunt & Friedrich Paul Berg

Post by Nessie » Fri May 04, 2018 5:23 am

Scott wrote:
Fri May 04, 2018 1:49 am
Nessie wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 5:06 am
Scott wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 6:31 pm
......

After World War II, during the Hostages Trial,[9] the seventh of the Nuremberg Trials, the tribunal found that, on the question of partisans, according to the then-current laws of war, the partisan fighters in southeast Europe could not be considered lawful belligerents under Article 1 of the Hague Convention. [10] In relation to Wilhelm List, the tribunal stated:

We are obliged to hold that such guerrillas were francs tireurs who, upon capture, could be subjected to the death penalty. Consequently, no criminal responsibility attaches to the defendant List because of the execution of captured partisans... [10]

The post-war Geneva Convention established new protocols; according to Article 4 of the Third Geneva Convention of 1949, francs-tireurs are entitled to prisoner-of-war status provided that they are commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates, have a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance, carry arms openly, and conduct their operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war. [Emphases added.]

/wiki/Francs-tireurs


I am not sure if you are trolling or genuinely struggling with the concept.

It is not me who is struggling. You claimed "Whatever they are called, under the Hague and Geneva international agreements (treaties) they are Illegal Combatants...." when I referenced civilians who fight back. That was wrong.

You have since moved the goalposts to irregular military and partisans. I accept that where a defeated and occupied country is able to organise those with military training, soldiers who avoided capture etc, those have been defined as illegal combatants.


In other words, you didn't know what you were talking about.
In other words, you made a claim which was wrong and then you moved the goalposts.
But--to give you the benefit of a doubt--since you had Germans or Nazis in mind, you thought that it was nothing just for civilians to open up on them with impunity.

:roll:
Lie. I am well aware if a French civilian shot a Nazi, they would be punished. :roll:
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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Scott
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Re: DEBATE between Eric Hunt & Friedrich Paul Berg

Post by Scott » Fri May 04, 2018 10:34 pm

And they were punished justifiably, more or less.

I even gave you a citation per request about the Wilhelm List judgement from Nuremberg, which cites international conventions--Hague and Geneva most common in this context.

Now, this judgement on behalf of the occupier might have gone differently if the victims were not Balkan and instead were maybe French or Polish, perhaps--let alone Jewish. The judgment might have also gone differently if the "evil occupiers" (aka "perpetrators") were not actually Nazis--but that does not nullify my point.

Field Marshall Wilhelm List also had a reputation of being afoul with the Nazi regime to some extent, which I am sure was an important Nuremberg journalistic nuance. He got the typical Life sentence but was also pardoned and released a few years later.

:)
TIME 24 March 1941
Image

“Now we have forced Hitler to war so he no longer can peacefully annihilate one piece of the Treaty of Versailles after the other.”
~ Major General J.F.C. Fuller,
historian – England

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Re: DEBATE between Eric Hunt & Friedrich Paul Berg

Post by Huntinger » Sun Oct 28, 2018 3:25 am

For new people here is the full debate. This is so interesting it should be revised. Thank you Friedrich.
Alles hat ein Ende, nur die Wurst hat zwei

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Re: DEBATE between Eric Hunt & Friedrich Paul Berg

Post by Goody67 » Sun Oct 28, 2018 8:54 am

Huntinger wrote:
Sun Oct 28, 2018 3:25 am
For new people here is the full debate. This is so interesting it should be revised. Thank you Friedrich.
YOU ARE LYING!!!!!!!!1111111

SHAME ON YOU!!!!!!!!!1111111

NONSENSE!!!!!!!!!!1111111

Jew Berg is incapable of having a reasonable debate, he always resorts to personal insults and is quite clearly not the sharpest tool in the shed.
Deniers are a few bricks short of a load.

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Friedrich Paul Berg
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Re: DEBATE between Eric Hunt & Friedrich Paul Berg

Post by Friedrich Paul Berg » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:59 pm

Well Goody67, Eric Hunt clearly "lied" when he insisted that the Germans had been given orders in late 1944 to stop gassing Jews. There is no trace of any such order.

Is the expression "shame on You" so egregious? I think not.

When I call something someone says "nonsense," is that so egregious? I think not.

FPBerg

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