‘International Jewry’? What was that prior to 1939? And what is it now?

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Statistical Mechanic
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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Tue May 06, 2014 1:28 pm

been-there wrote:Reducing EVERY contemporary criticism of what was perceived at the time as the work of 'Jews' or 'World Jewry' is the usual scare tactic: "Don't go there. Don't go there. Don't you DARE go there. Or else..."
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Blah, blah, blah. Basically what is being argued then, is that EVERYBODY is an anti-semite who dares to try to correctly understand this period of history?! :roll:
What a simplistic and idiotic reduction.

So Bertrand Russel? How about him? Was he also an anti-semite?
This is just ad homenim taken to the nth degree. AND that really is all people here have as a refutation. Post after post of such fallacious reasoning. Which is quite sad really, when it is not just pathetic.

Anyway, back to the actual history, here is Bertrand Russel writing in private, back in 1920.
. . . Yet from where the thought-patrol lackeys are sitting, Russel would be classified as an anti-semite. :o
Which shows how bogus the reasoning is.

I recommend anyone who wants to get a broader and more impartial understanding should ignore this type of slur in the previous five posts to this one.
Such pretence at 'knowledge' as is being displayed by the Rodoh-troll-trio I consider as worse than no knowledge at all. The constant hectoring and ridicule is merely an attempt at a form of intellectual bullying.
It doesn't work on me.
This has what to do with, as you argued, a clique of International Jewry seeking to instigate war against Germany with all means at their disposal? Or is this meant to supplement a collection of "What Folks Have Written About Jews"?

You've created a truly garish and disorderly wallpaper of some commonplace comments about Jews and now Jews and the Bolsheviks, crowned now by Bertrand Russell's remarkably odd observation that "Americanised Jews" (Trotsky did after all live in NYC for 3 months, where, not speaking English, he he wrote articles for Russian-language newspapers, and was from a non-religious Jewish family) composed the Communists' aristocracy, being the same Communists who made peace with the Central Powers including Germany at Brest-Litovsk.

As Bernard asked, what is all this disorganized and disparate material trying to say - in your own words, thinking for yourself? No cribbing, ok?
"the Germans had ample justifiable cause to oppose a minority within their society who worked AGAINST their county's interests" -- been-there, 24 April 2014

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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Tue May 06, 2014 1:38 pm

Yes, I am pretty sure that been-there posted the Bertrand Russell letter thinking of the Jew Trotsky . . . on account of his rule in instigating war against Germany in concert with Untermyer, Morgenthau, the Rothschilds, and Kaufman - working with hidden hands alongside Stalin, Churchill, and FDR. Trotsky being a major Red Jew he was definitely behind Stalin.
"the Germans had ample justifiable cause to oppose a minority within their society who worked AGAINST their county's interests" -- been-there, 24 April 2014

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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by Bernard » Tue May 06, 2014 1:53 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:Yes, I am pretty sure that been-there posted the Bertrand Russell letter thinking of the Jew Trotsky . . . on account of his rule in instigating war against Germany in concert with Untermyer, Morgenthau, the Rothschilds, and Kaufman - working with hidden hands alongside Stalin, Churchill, and FDR. Trotsky being a major Red Jew he was definitely behind Stalin.
But did they meet in outer space? Is been-there of the intergalactic reptilian illuminati Jew exposers?

I think that the Bertrand RusselL spam might have been to show that even respectable, left-leaning sorts were creeped out by this Jew thing. If Bertrand Russell had a thing about Jews, than why freak out about Hitler? Of course, Russell never said that these Jews were acting as Jews, just that they seemed to reming him of Barbra Streisand and Don Rickles, but not as much fun.

So, Stat Mack, you don't think been-there is spewing jibberish, with some vague theme about people seeing Jews doing nasty things?

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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by been-there » Tue May 06, 2014 2:13 pm

More on how there was a widely held perception in the 1920's concerning a groups of "like-thinking men at the highest levels", "chief financial backers and supporters" of royalty, etc., men who were "bound together" with "ties of race and interest" and who operated within an undisclosed "international 'network'" whereby they could "secretly" "influence the political decisions of a score of countries."
Now what else would you call such a body of men who were "bound together" with "ties of race and interest"??
The more you look into it, the more the honest amd impartial reader must acknowledge that this WAS the perception of the time, EVEN of people passionately opposed to Hitler.
The question is how much that was a real or imaginary "international 'network'" and how much the ties binding them were Jewish and/or Zionist and/or Bolshevik?

It really doesn't help to dismiss this as anti-semitism in a thread asking the question what exactly was being described in this time period both by its supporters, participants and enemies as "International Jewry".
As predicted, the ad hominem backlash has been the expected nonsensical response.
Of this international "network" of like-thinking men at the highest level, in Dr. Herzl's day, the student may only make a picture by carefully piecing together significant glimpses and fragments (its existence and concerted actions in our time are plainly demonstrable, as this book in its later chapters will show, from the growing mass of literature). For instance, Dr. Weizmann says he told Dr. Herzl that Sir Francis Montefiore (a leading Jew in England) was "a fool", whereon Herzl answered, "He opens kingly portals to me". Again, one Baron de Hirsch was Herzl's chief financial backer and supporter. Of this Baron de Hirsch Count Carl Lonyay (quoting from documents in the secret archives of the Imperial Court at Vienna) says that Crown Prince Rudolf of Austria, wishing to make provision for a woman friend before his suicide at Mayerling, obtained 100,000 gulden "from the banker, Baron Hirsch, in return for an act of friendliness he had performed in December, when he invited the banker to meet the Prince of Wales" (the future Kind Edward VII).

Baron de Hirsch, in the sequence to this introduction, became an intimate of the Prince of Wales, and private banker and financial adviser to the future King of England. He was also brother-in-law of a Mr. Bischoffsheim of the Jewish financial house of Bischoffsheim and Goldschmidt in London, of which a very rich German-born Jew, Sir Ernest Cassel, was a member. Sir Ernest, as Mr. Brian Connell says in a biographical study, fell heir to Baron de Hirsch's friendship with the future king: "where Hirsch had been an intimate, Cassel was to become Edward VII's closest personal friend". He was indeed the last of the king's intimates to see him alive, the king, on the day of his death, insisting on keeping an appointment with Sir Edward and rising to dress himself for the purpose.

In the sequence to this account Mr. Connell says: "The small international fraternity of which he" (Sir Ernest Cassel) "became perhaps the leading member were all men with backgrounds similar to his own, people whom he approached in the course of his extensive travels. There was Max Warburg, head of the great private banking house in Hamburg; Edouard Noetzlin, honorary president of the Banque de Paris et des Pays Bas, in Paris; Franz Philippson in Brussels; Wertheim and Gompertz in Amsterdam and, above all, Jacob Schiff of the firm of Kuhn, Loeb and Company in New York. Ties of race and interest bound these men together. The web of their communications quivered at the slightest touch. They maintained between them an incredibly accurate network of economic, political and financial intelligence at the highest level. They could withdraw support here, provide additional funds there, move immense sums of money with lightning rapidity and secrecy from one corner to another of their financial empires, and influence the political decisions of a score of countries".
--Douglas Reed quoting a biographer of Sir Ernest Cassell. 'The Controversy of Zion', pgs. 204-205.
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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by been-there » Tue May 06, 2014 2:52 pm

Image
Image
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Great Britain, Palestine and the Jews by Samuel Landman

Samuel Landman was a well-known English Zionist, was Hon. Secretary of the Joint Zionist Council of the United Kingdom in 1912, Joint Editor of the" Zionist" in 1913-14 and author of pamphlets on "History of Zionism" and "Zionism, its organisation and institutions" published during the war.
From 1917 to 1922 he was Solicitor and Secretary to the Zionist Organisation. At the time of writing this pamphlet he was Legal Adviser to the New Zionist Organisation.

Landman confirms in detail that 'Jews' set in motion - by their own admission and in pursuit of Jewish interests - America's entry into World War One against Germany.
"In Germany, the value of the bargain to the Allies, apparently, was duly and carefully noted. In his Through Thirty Years, Mr. Wickham Steed, in a chapter appreciative of the value of Zionist support in America and elsewhere to the Allied cause, says General Ludendorff is alleged to have said after the War that: "The Balfour Declaration was the cleverest thing done by the Allies in the way of propaganda, and that he wished Germany had thought of it first" (vol. 2, p. 392).
As a matter of fact, this was said by Ludendorff to Sir Alfred Mond (afterwards Lord Melchett), soon after the War.
The fact that it was Jewish help that brought USA into the War on the side of the Allies has rankled ever since in German – especially Nazi – minds, and has contributed in no small measure to the prominence which anti-Semitism occupies in the Nazi programme."
-- S. Landman. 'Great Britain, The Jews and Palestine', pp. 3-6.
"When people who are honestly mistaken learn the truth,
they either cease being mistaken
or they cease being honest"
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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by Don Quijote » Tue May 06, 2014 3:55 pm

Mr. Been-There's point is quite clear, one cannot deny the Zionist influence in politics and media throughout history. Does people really deny the influence of this "International Jewry" even in today's politics, pushing world powers to war against Iraq and now Iran?

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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Tue May 06, 2014 4:17 pm

been-there wrote:To correctly and impartially understand what was happening in Germany between the wars, one HAS to try and understand what was the contemporary perspective, regardless of whether that perceived perspective was based upon real or imaginary forces.
(I.e. Strawman 'Protocols of Zion' comparisons are an obfuscatory and therefore dishonest tactic.)
Since as my post pointed out international Aryans circulated and promoted and referred to the "truths" contained in the Protocols? Is that what you're getting at? Dishonest obfuscation because related directly to the propaganda and thinking of international Aryan leaders like Hitler and Goebbels, who are germane to understanding of this period, or "obfuscatory and therefore dishonest" because the fact that your heroes lie and deceive doesn't sit well with you, being expressed out loud?
Last edited by Statistical Mechanic on Tue May 06, 2014 4:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"the Germans had ample justifiable cause to oppose a minority within their society who worked AGAINST their county's interests" -- been-there, 24 April 2014

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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by Statistical Mechanic » Tue May 06, 2014 4:23 pm

Don Quijote wrote:Mr. Been-There's point is quite clear, one cannot deny the Zionist influence in politics and media throughout history. Does people really deny the influence of this "International Jewry" even in today's politics, pushing world powers to war against Iraq and now Iran?
Welcome to the forum, Don. Glad to have a new/old voice.

People "does" not find germane to a discussion of the 'thirties, and the WWII era, your musings - or been-there's, which will be forthcoming I assume - on Zionist influence in today's world and especially in support of the American war against Iraq.

This was our topic:
What was International Jewry?
Did such a body exist?
How did such a body EXIST?
Who were they?
So the topic isn't "Zionist influence" - Zionists (which ones are you referring to?) being some Jews but not necessarily being all of "international Jewry"; you see, the thread really is about "international Jewry," whom been-there has been connecting in recent posts not to Zionists but to the Communists - and which been-there has yet to define for us.

Will you be so kind as to define "international Jewry," about which been-there did once tell us, without fully explaining further, "a clique of International Jewry sought to instigate war against Germany with all means at their disposal"? How was this small, exclusive group of like-minded people organized, who belonged to it and which Jews didn't belong, what were the clique's agreed ends, and what were all the means used to achieve these ends?

Thanks, SM
"the Germans had ample justifiable cause to oppose a minority within their society who worked AGAINST their county's interests" -- been-there, 24 April 2014

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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by been-there » Tue May 06, 2014 5:01 pm

Statistical Mechanic wrote:... the topic isn't "Zionist influence" - Zionists... being some Jews but not necessarily being all of "international Jewry"; you see, the thread really is about "international Jewry," not to Zionists but to the Communists - and which been-there has yet to define for us.
Miscomprehension again.
This thread is NOT about communists. Its about "International Jewry".
And it is not intended to be a definition but is asking the question what that was, how that was perceived at the time of WW2, before and after.
As usual I am providing historical references and St. Meck is just dismissing them by misrepresenting them.
"When people who are honestly mistaken learn the truth,
they either cease being mistaken
or they cease being honest"
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Re: International Jewry? What was that prior to and after 19

Post by Nessie » Tue May 06, 2014 5:04 pm

Balsamo wrote:
.......

He started his article in praise of the “good Jews” among them Prime Minister Disraeli, calling the Jews “the most remarkable race which has ever appeared in the world.” He stated that Jews (the good ones) are an essential contribution of one country’s prosperity…basically he makes the clear distinction between eastern Jews tempted by Communism, eastern Jews victims of the first ones and western Jews where Hitler would tried his best to assimilate them in a vast international conspiracy.

He names the bad Jews – the Communist and anarchist ones – from soviet Trotsky to Emma Goldman – not because they are Jews, but because they represent in his view the “evil”, who are part of a Global international Communist conspiracy, not a Jewish international conspiracy promoting Communism.

...
So Churchill realised there was no such thing as just the Jews and some are good and some are bad and probably others come inbetween as well. Shame been-there is unable to understand how that works and that some Jews were anti-Germany under the Nazis and joined organisations to boycott such, some were very unhappy about the boycott and many just wanted to get on with lives without bothering anyone else.
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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