What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

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Huntinger
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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Huntinger » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:00 pm

Nessie wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:12 am
You will see the witnesses state that on arrival at TII, the Nazis were looking for workers, they were selected to work and then were transported to another camp.
At an extermination camp there is only one function: death. If there is another function as suggested it is not an extermination facility but a transit facility. Perhaps there is a morph now to duel functions.

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Nessie » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:52 pm

Turnagain wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 1:06 pm
Nessie wrote:
Here are all the images relating to the electrical resistance and GPR underground surveys that are in the report.
Thus begins Nessie's weasel dodge. Note how he ever so carefully refers to "disturbed ground" rather than a direct reference to mass graves. As is noted in the dissertation, all of the figures from 4.8 through 4.22 refer to structural remains. Nothing whatsoever to do with mass graves but yes, there is some "disturbed ground". Those are called "building sites", Nessie.
What buildings were there? Show me your evidence that the yellow areas between the memorial and the trees relate to buildings. Show me how 4.8 to 4.22 are all structural remains.

"Another feature (G44), located adjacent to the memorial in the south west of Area B, represents a substantial anomaly (Figures 4.29 and 4.32). This feature is bisected by the memorial, which was purportedly sited according to the location of mass graves in this part of the camp (Figure 4.29). However, the discovery of this feature raises an important issue; it highlights the fact that a comprehensive examination of subsurface remains must not have been undertaken in advance of the memorial's construction, given that this feature was partially missed. Post-abandonment aerial images confirm the presence of this feature as an area of significant ground disturbance (Figure 4.29)"

Then;

"Five pits were located with the GPR (G50-G54) on the eastern side of the Death Camp (Figures 4.29 and 4.34). Although the GPR survey was unable to achieve a large enough depth range to determine the full extent of these pits, it is possible to say that they were all deeper than four metres and that they were all of considerable size in plan (G50 was visible to an extent of 34m x 12m, G51-19m x 12m, G52 – 22m x c.15m, G53 – c.18m x 7m and G54 was visible to 20.8m x c. 14m). Given their location in the area thought to contain most of the mass graves and their proximity to the memorial, there is a strong case for arguing that they represent further disposals."

That equates to volumes of 1,632m3, 912m3, 1320m3, 504m3 and 1154.8m3 (total 5532.8). An adult is 0.07m3, so that is enough to bury 79,040 people.

The GPR only goes down to 4m max and there is far more area that cannot be surveyed than can be surveyed. So that is a small proportion of how many could have buried at the camp.

The report uses the term ground disturbance, as do I. That is because we do not know amongst the disturbed ground, where the original graves were precisely located. We know from the aerial photo a large area was dug up and as the report acknowledges, there was "post war looting activity". Where multiple witnesses state the mass graves were located at the camp, large areas of disturbed ground have been found, which extend under the memorial.

Unless you can evidence the Nazis were digging for another innocent reason at the camp, then the evidence those ground disturbances are part of some of the former mass graves stands.
CS-C becomes very vague about the alleged gas chambers. No investigation with her "20-probe Wenner array" or the GPR. However she does mention seeing some bricks partially buried in the ground and of course we all know that the gas chambers were made from bricks...or somepin'. So much for scientific rigor and objectivity.
Witnesses, giving testimony post war, in trials and statements spoke of the gas chambers being made from concrete, brick, with tiles interiors and the colours of the tiles. That C S-C's team found that buried at the camp in 2011 means that the witnesses are corroborated by the physical evidence.
We finally get down to CS-C's interpretation of the electrical imaging showing some irregularly shaped holes that she conveniently measures for maximums of width and length. CS-C brags fulsomely on the technical virtues of her GPR rig and then shows ONE (1), yes, count 'em, ONE plate of what she claims to be the edge of a pit although she previously bragged on the equipment's 3-D capabilities. Doesn't look as though CS-C had as much luck with the GPR as she did with the electrical imaging.
You are lying, read from 4.3.2, from page 470;

T11 - Narrow, linear feature. Culminates in two small pits (largest 7.5 x 3.5m)
G1 - Probable pit
G4 - Probable pit. May extend beyond the survey area.
G38 - Probable pit. Cut visible in section from 0.8 -3.60m. Possibly extends beyond the survey area to the east, west and south.
G44 - Probable pit. Probably extends under the monument. On NNW-SSE alignment. Possibly same feature as G16 and G17
G50 - Probable pit. Possibly extends under the monument to the north and east. Apparent cut visible at 1m-full depth of survey. Sloped edge visible to west in section.
G51 - Probable pit. Aligned NE-SW.
G54 - Probable pit. Aligned NE-SW.
G32 - Probable pit

There are more in the Section F.
Oh well, Nessie is trying his best to morph the mass graves into "disturbed ground" and CS-C's little adventure at Treblinka is the best he can do. I don't suppose that it will do any good to remind him that we're looking for giant mass graves up to 40 feet deep, not some "ground disturbances". Remember...

No cremains, no graves, no holyhoax. Finito. End of story.
So, what is the evidence to back that up? I have shown you ground disturbances where witnesses state there had been mass graves.
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Norm » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:59 pm

Nessie:
I have shown you ground disturbances where witnesses state there had been mass graves.

Let's see the proof Nessie.
I, Nessie, am so confident in my belief that the Treblinka II holocaust happened as alleged in orthodox historiography

and in my statements made here:

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=4018&start=30#p160227

and here:

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2948#p108168

that I am willing to bet _$?$_ that I can prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, that - there is a preponderance of conclusively documented and substantiated empirical evidence - that: no less than _?_ mass graves were dug and utilized as such at Treblinka II.
Look at Nessie run from the simple question!

:lol:

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Nessie » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:12 pm

Turnagain wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 1:31 pm
Nessie wrote:
How do you know that the Soviets had any TII records?
OK, I'll amend that to somebody either destroyed, lost or hid the outbound train schedules from Treblinka. In any event, they're gone. Nobody can lay their hands on them and say, "See, here are the previously lost train schedules from Treblinka".
Why are only the TII camp records missing and not records from other places showing transports to TII?

The missing records from TII are indicative of the cover up, why we see with the physical evidence as the camp was razed to the ground.
How come we have third party records, such as Hofle, Gazenmuller, Stroop and Korherr and various ghetto records that report mass daily arrivals at the camp, but there are no corresponding records of mass daily departures?
Gee, that's a real head scratcher, Nessie. Lemme' see, if I was going to make up a cockamamie fantasy about people getting gassed, buried, dug up and cremated I suppose that the first thing I would do is get rid of any records that showed my fantasy to be a load of horse frocky. Ya' think?

BTW, the Stroop report is a phony.
Your conspiracy theory crap is unevidenced. Occam's Razor tells us that a cover up of criminal activity by the Nazis is the far more likely reason for a lack of records. There is no evidence the Stroop Report is phoney, just denier opinion, which is the biased thoughts of non experts.
Which you dodge because you know that there is no evidence...
No, I don't "dodge" your incessant whine of, "Where did they goooo?". I absolutely and positively don't give a fat rat's patootie about where the Jews went after they left Treblinka. How many times do I have to tell you that? Maybe the Poles, the Ukrainians, the Estonians, the Germans or even the Russians whacked them somewhere else but the fact remains that they weren't gassed/smothered, buried, dug up and cremated on the magic Jew barbeque at Treblinka. What can't you understand about that, Nessie?
That is you dodging dealing with the issue that there is no evidence they left the camp in daily mass transports. The reason why you dodge that is because, since it is not evidenced, it did not happen. Those people DID NOT LEAVE TII.

The only way they could still be there, is if they were killed and buried and cremated.
You need to watch the interviews Hunt's video edits down.
Give a link to those extended interviews or give it rest. While you're at it, keep in mind...

No cremains, no graves, no holyhoax. Finito. End of story.
The original interviews are in the "Shoah" documentary from 1985 and you claim to have watched Hunt's video, so you have seen the edits where the witnesses talk of being sent to Majdanek to work.

Lots of evidence of mass graves, cremains, gassings and small groups sent to Majdanek to work. No evidence of daily mass transports from TII. #

Why should I believe what you cannot evidence????
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Nessie » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:16 pm

Look at the deniers run from the simple question of, what happened to the "resettled" Jews?

All they want to talk about is mass graves and when they are shown evidence of ground disturbances consistent with the evidence from witnesses and an aerial photo that the Nazis were digging large pits at TII, they complain it is not enough.

There is evidence of graves, gassings and cremations. There is no evidence of daily mass transports back out of the camp.
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Norm » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:21 pm

Nessie:
Those people DID NOT LEAVE TII... they were killed and buried... the Nazis were digging large pits at TII... There is evidence of graves...

Let's see the proof Nessie.
I, Nessie, am so confident in my belief that the Treblinka II holocaust happened as alleged in orthodox historiography

and in my statements made here:

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=4018&start=30#p160227

and here:

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2948#p108168

that I am willing to bet _$?$_ that I can prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, that - there is a preponderance of conclusively documented and substantiated empirical evidence - that: no less than _?_ mass graves were dug and utilized as such at Treblinka II.
Look at Nessie run from the simple question!

:lol:

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Huntinger » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:47 pm

Nessie wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:16 pm
There is evidence of graves, gassings and cremations. There is no evidence of daily mass transports back out of the camp.
This poster is simply going around in circles. There is no hard evidence of graves, gassings, cremations just anecdotes and some phony eye witnesses. This has been dealt with ad nauseam. No amount of screeching and use of adminicles is going to make the evidence harder despite what Dr Terry may say. There may well be ground disturbances, but the cause of those disturbances is conjecture at best. Just like the fake extermination lager in Warsaw, falsehoods were intricately built around known facts. There may well be graves and bodies; however, the cause of death, the time of death and the ethnicity is unknown. To make assumptions based on fake eyewitnesses is not sound.

It is only this poster that is saying that there should be mass daily transports out. Trains are only used for long distances; if these camps were used as work transit and de lousing facilities then there are multiple ways to exit the camps to nearby work stations. The options are walking, trucking, cycling, horse and cart or indeed another train ride. Pierre Berg experienced all of these methods used by the Reich during his experiences at the Birkenau sub camps.

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Turnagain » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:36 pm

Nessie rants and raves about "disturbed ground" and whines incessantly about "Where did they go?" but is quiet as a little church mouse about the mouthings of such luminaries as Wassili Grossman, the Soviet propagandist and Rachel Auerbach, the protagonist for flammable blood and the Treblinka vacuum chambers. Neither does he take note of the claim by CS-C that the M&H draglines were used to dig the graves and exhume the bodies.

Of course CS-C goes along with the magic Jew barbeque but reduces the number cremated to about 200 per session. If there had been four (4) roasting sessions per day it would have taken the eeevul Narzis about 1,100 days to cremate all of the bodies. Oh well, must have been those (heh-heh) little "mistakes" at work.

So, Nessie, if you are so confident that upwards of 750,000 victims were first buried at Treblinka, exhumed with the M&H draglines and cremated on the magic Jew barbeque along with another 150,000 to 200,000 victims who were just gassed and cremated why don't you take up Norm's challenge? Go for the NAFCA cash or put some money where your mouth is? Why all the weasel dodging?

Oh, wait a minute, I know. It's because...

No cremains, no graves, no holyhoax. Finito. End of story.

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Nessie » Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:55 am

Turnagain wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:36 pm
Nessie rants and raves about "disturbed ground" and whines incessantly about "Where did they go?" but is quiet as a little church mouse about the mouthings of such luminaries as Wassili Grossman, the Soviet propagandist and Rachel Auerbach, the protagonist for flammable blood and the Treblinka vacuum chambers. Neither does he take note of the claim by CS-C that the M&H draglines were used to dig the graves and exhume the bodies.
They are not evidence, they are secondary sources. To find out what happened, you need evidence from primary sources.
Of course CS-C goes along with the magic Jew barbeque but reduces the number cremated to about 200 per session. If there had been four (4) roasting sessions per day it would have taken the eeevul Narzis about 1,100 days to cremate all of the bodies. Oh well, must have been those (heh-heh) little "mistakes" at work.

So, Nessie, if you are so confident that upwards of 750,000 victims were first buried at Treblinka, exhumed with the M&H draglines and cremated on the magic Jew barbeque along with another 150,000 to 200,000 victims who were just gassed and cremated why don't you take up Norm's challenge? Go for the NAFCA cash or put some money where your mouth is? Why all the weasel dodging?

Oh, wait a minute, I know. It's because...

No cremains, no graves, no holyhoax. Finito. End of story.
I have explained before why I will not participate again in Gerdes challenge, unless he agrees to certain conditions.

I will remind you that the burden of proof is on you to evidence no graves, cremains and gassings and mass daily departures from TII.

Why should I believe what you cannot evidence?
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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Re: What happened to the "resettled" Jews?

Post by Huntinger » Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:17 am

Nessie wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:55 am
I will remind you that the burden of proof is on you to evidence no graves, cremains and gassings and mass daily departures from TII.

Why should I believe what you cannot evidence?
In most of history when major genocides or events occur there may be conflicts on the details but not on the whole event. In this case the whole event is in question, as apart from rumours and fake eye witnesses, there is a very true possibility this did not occur. If something of such magnitude did occur there would be ample evidence to convince anyone who doubted, often physical. There is little doubt the "Killing fields" in Cambodia instigated by the Khmer Rouge are more or less true; I have no doubt that a vast amount of hard evidence is available to confirm the claims.

In this case, everything is airy fairy and magical, no substance; fantastic stories which morph. In the end we are expected to believe the last morphing was true. As it stands the gaskammer morph is failing so a holocaust by bullets is now taking its place. For each of those morphs people were executed, they were innocent of steaming, tearing kids in two or setting blood on fire. It is all as true as the soap, the lampshades and the shrunken heads.

To keep on asking for evidence of mass departures when this has been dealt with numerous times is tantamount to trolling to be frank, especially when this scenario is only in the mind of the poster with little proximity to reality.

There is insufficient evidence of the posters belief, but it continues.

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