Where did they go

[Huntinger]

We often read statements by hoaxers such as the following:

Why should anyone believe what you cannot evidence?

This is a fair statement, as it suggests empirical evidence (synthetic a posteriori), knowledge of the real world is required to "know" something as opposed to finding something true by mere thought (analytic a priori).

A plaque was placed at Auschwitz to signify that 4 million people had perished at the camps at the hands of the Nazis.

This was accepted as "fact" worldwide, to question this tenet of belief would leave one open to criticism and labeling of being an anti Semite, or even worse, a neo-Nazi

The issue of the Einsatz Reinhardt camps comes up for which the hoaxers say were death camps to cater for the other 2 million dead.

4 million Auschwitz + 2 Million elsewhere = 6 million

The argument the hoaxers give goes like:

How do they transport, feed, clothe and accommodate 1.274 million people by the end of 1942, without leaving any evidence at all.

This is just another version of asking the question of where did they go. It also leaves 726, 000 for the Einzatsgruppen to murder; the holocaust by bullets scenario. (In the meantime I will forget the fact that the people shot were Partizani terrorists).

moving on, years later

Back at the Auschwitz complex which includes Birkenau and all of the subcamps, a new plaque is created, a replacement with revised figures:

This replacement seems to have been done in the early 90s but the date is not relevant atm.

What we have is a reduction of numbers, from 4 million to 1.5 million, a difference of 2.5 million; the numbers are now reduced even further to 1.1 million a loss of 2.9 million.

Conclusion
Prior to the new numbers and plaque the hoaxer could have said:

How do they transport, feed, clothe and accommodate 2.9 million people by the end of 1942 from Auschwitz, without leaving any evidence at all.

Of course these people never existed at the camp let alone perished there.

Likewise

When it comes to the AR camps the hoaxer question of "where did they go" can be revised:

How do they transport, feed, clothe and accommodate 1.274 million people by the end of 1942, without leaving any evidence at all.

This question has no bearing as the answer is identical to the Auschwitz fabrication of numbers; these people did not exist.
Like the magical disappear 2.9 million people overnight, the 1.274 million can simply swirl and go down the same drainpipe.

It is accepted that the Einsatzgruppen took police action again Partizani with some collateral damage after over a million German soldiers of the Heer were murdered. This leaves 3.1 million people unaccounted; it is accepted that typhus and normal attrition took 1.2 million. This leaves 2 million. The Soviets took 1.2 million of these people with Poles into the Russian Interior. This has been referenced here many times. At the start of Barbarossa the Soviets fled and took the Poles with them.
We are now left with 800 000 missing people which can easily be dismissed if the fudging of the original statistics by der Juden is taken into account, they are paper people only.

[Werd]

Anyone who goes to check page 3 of "What things have Holocaust revisionists managed to change from the Holocaust narrative?" will see me offer a perfect response to argument about the Auschwitz plaques. In short, academics still considered Jews to be the majority of the 4 million figure, at a whopping 2.5 million! Meaning that when the new 1.5 million plaque came, whereby experts put Jews at 900,000 or 1 million, that means that 1.5 Jews got revised out of existence!

viewtopic.php?p=162940#p162940

In other words, BOTH OBJECTIONS the gas chamber mongers have fail.

This is true, but remember that these two are from Klowns and are trolling you.

I still believe that even if the total figure was claimed 4 million at one point, it was still claimed the number of Jews was the majority when that 4 million plaque was up. If someone wants to prove THE OPPOSITE, and claim that even when Auschwitz said 4 million, that Jews were still thought of as less than 1.5 million, and thus thought of as a MINORITY compared to EVERYONE ELSE, then I will withdraw this line of argumentation and admit my error.

Edit:
I may have to do just that.

although it is correct to note that the Polish Communist government did claim that four million people were exterminated at Auschwitz, historians (Feig, Reitlinger, Hilberg, et al.) have never supported that figure.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/ho ... -auschwitz

Indeed, the Soviets came up with the four million figure and communist Poles fell in line.

Previously, plaques in front of the ″International Monument to Victims of Fascism″ spoke of 4 million victims. Poles, not Jews, were listed first among the victimized peoples.

https://apnews.com/4de24d2430cd2e900602ecf14b1db341

I mean if Poles were first, they must have been the largest and the communists must have hijacked a Jewish holocaust, and used a big number whereby they made Jews the minority? You know for communist, anti-fascist political reasons, right?

The fiction that more than a million non-Jews died here was a myth created by Poland`s communist leaders.

It was only after the fall of the last communist government in 1989 that Polish historians were finally allowed to say what Franciszek Piper, manager of historical department at Auschwitz, says he had known for five years. Jewish scholars say they knew the truth for at least 10 years.

But Piper, an ex-communist Pole, and Jewish historians have different explanations of why it took so long for the truth to come out.

Sitting in his drab little Auschwitz office, filled with books on the transport of prisoners and the operation of crematoriums, Piper said that years of research were needed to get to the truth and that then, ''the people in charge of publishing'' in communist Poland ''didn`t believe'' the lower number.

However, Jewish Holocaust specialists said they suspected more malevolent motives.

''The numbers that we dealt with before were numbers that were politically motivated,'' said Miles Lerman, chairman of international relations for the U.S. Holocaust Memorial Council in Washington.

The communists tried to ''de-Judaize'' Auschwitz to emphasize that other nationalities, particularly Poles, died at the hands of the Nazis, said Lerman, who is also a member of the International Council of the State Museum of Auschwitz.

[...]

The communists tried not only here but also in the former Soviet Union and throughout Eastern Europe to de-emphasize the suffering of the Jews, said Aaron Breitbart, research director for the Simon Wiesenthal Center in Los Angeles.

''The communists looked at the war against Nazism not as a human issue but as one ideology fighting another, so they tended to misappropriate the Holocaust for their own political goals,'' said Breitbart.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct- ... story.html

JUST KIDDING!

Of the 4 million, the number of Jewish victims was often put at 2.5 million in postwar publications, wrongly suggesting that the Nazis had killed more than 1 million non-Jews there.

https://apnews.com/4de24d2430cd2e900602ecf14b1db341

There we go. CONFIRMATION that no matter what the number claimed, JEWS WERE ALWAYS CONSIDERED THE MAJORITY!!! Let's read a 1989 article before the first plaque was changed.

IDEAS & TRENDS; Auschwitz Revisionism: An Israeli Scholar's Case

By Peter Steinfels

Nov. 12, 1989

[...]

Although differing estimates of the Auschwitz death toll were reported during the furor this year about the location of a Roman Catholic convent at the concentration camp site, the most frequently cited figures list 2.5 million Jewish victims and 1.5 million others, most of them presumed to be Polish. At the end of September, Mr. Bauer published an article in The Jerusalem Post calling those figures ''patently false.''

Five years ago, he said, research by the French Jewish historian Georges Wellers had established that approximately 1.6 million people were gassed, executed by other means, tortured to death or were victims of starvation or disease at Auschwitz. According to these findings, about 1.35 million were Jews. There were 83,000 Polish victims, 20,000 Gypsies and 12,000 Soviet prisoners of war. An additional 150,000 Poles were imprisoned at Auschwitz, then shipped elsewhere where many, although not the majority, died.

Mr. Bauer, who is in the United States participating in several scholarly conferences on the Holocaust, said that his article had ''created quite a rumpus in Israel.'' He received calls and letters asking, ''Why is this Bauer going around saying a million fewer Jews died at Auschwitz?''

https://www.nytimes.com/1989/11/12/week ... -case.html

Thus, the gas chamber monger's only possible counter-argument is "the four million was an exaggeration by communists who put Jews as a minority" IS TOTALLY WRONG!!! No possible counter argument. My hunch about Jews being considered a majority even in the "four million" days has been proven correct. I win. They have nothing.

HISTORIAN OFFERS LOWER DEATH TOLL AT AUSCHWITZ.
Peter Steinfels, The New York Times
January 3, 1990.

At Auschwitz, it is inscribed in stone: 4 million people died in the Nazi camps.

But Yehuda Bauer, one of the foremost historians of the Holocaust and a sworn enemy of those who deny its reality, says that the number of victims was less than half that.

[...]

Although the news media quoted differing estimates of the Auschwitz death toll during the controversy this year about the location of a Roman Catholic convent at the concentration camp site, the most frequently cited figures list 2.5 million Jewish victims and 1.5 million others, most of them presumed to be Polish.

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-xp ... story.html

viewtopic.php?p=162943#p162943

In the end, yes, with the plaque changing, we can deduce that there was AT MINIMUM, an inherent reduction of at least one million Jews. All we had to do was take the respective plaque totals, and find out their respective Jew totals within those overall totals. Simple work. And yet nobody wanted to do that much work. Gee, I wonder why!

So I wonder if those idiots will go back to the skeptics forum (with different names there of course) and say, "Damnit! Werd just destroyed the holocaust controversies article, and other idiots who always try to claim that the second plaque which puts Jews at just around 900,000 out of 1.5 million, was the ONLY plaque/number that had Jews as the majority, and that the four million figure merely accommodates those 900,000 Jews mentioned in the 1.5 million plaque. It turns out, he found proof that even with the four million figure, Jews were still considered a majority. So I guess we have no counter arguments to those who mention the plaques."

Highly doubtful.

[Werd]

And guess where those missing just over 1 million Jews went that got revised out of the first Auschwitz plaque? They got smuggled into the new totals for Chelmno, the AR camps, and the Einsatzgruppen campaigns. How else do you think they retained the Talmudic 6 million prophecy number?

[Huntinger]

How else do you think they retained the Talmudic 6 million prophecy number?

This is agreed, especially as Majdanek numbers were imploding at a rate similar to Auschwitz. In 1989 Auschwitz corrected its monuments and reduced the number of deaths from 4 million to 1.1 million yet the 6 million total never changed (the savings at Auschwitz were picked up in other camps). Also, the International Red Cross and detailed German death records indicate that only about 150,000 died at Auschwitz of whom 30,000 were Habiru. Maly Trostinets is one of the camps to help account of the numbers.

The Chicago Tribune has this to say:

The ‘new’ 1.5 million revised down from 4 million is IMO, far from the truth. The real figure is closer to 300,000. The majority of the dead were Habiru but they died not due to ‘gassing’ more due to natural causes: disease, hunger …

How will history remember the Holocaust, historic horror or historic hoax? It depends on whether or not World Zionism controls the history? J gle currently phases out any dissenting work on the alleged holocaust; they followed J tube which cancelled the accounts of all people who even discussed the holocaust politely from a revisionist perspective. (probably J gle is the worst browser one can use; think about the meta data collection.

[Huntinger]

After the Soviet invasion of Poland following the corresponding German invasion that marked the start of World War II in 1939, the Soviet Union annexed eastern parts (known as Kresy to the Polish or as West Belarus and West Ukraine in the USSR and among Belarusians and Ukrainians) of the Second Polish Republic, which since then became western parts of the Belarusian SSR and the Ukrainian SSR. During 1939–1941, 1.45 million people inhabiting the region were deported by the Soviet regime. According to Polish historians, 63.1% of these people were Poles and 7.4% were Juden. Previously it was believed that about 1.0 million Polish citizens died at the hands of the Soviets, but recently Polish historians, based mostly on queries in Soviet archives, estimate the number of deaths at about 350,000 people deported in 1939–1945.
The Soviets bragged they transported 1.7 million Juden inland.

If the lower death estimates are correct then this means that the Soviets had 1.1 million people for which 82 thousand were juden.

After World War II, Poland and Soviet Ukraine conducted population exchanges; Poles who resided east of the established Poland–Soviet border were deported to Poland (c.a. 2,100,000 persons) and Ukrainians that resided west of the established Poland-Soviet Union border were deported to Soviet Ukraine.

This means that during the War there should have been 1.1 million Poles in Soviet Territory and yet there are a million more. It is highly likely that these would be people on the borders with a huge number of Juden. Korherr said 1.274 million Juden had been "processed" at the camps of General Government and 145,000 at the camps in Warthegau (location of Kulmhof). 1.42 million of 2.1 million is 68% Jude. No doubt the other 20 thousand Juden were still in Siberia. There is no information of transports out of the regions.

Conclusion

1.45 million annexed by Soviets, 350 000 perish leaving 1.1 million.
2.1 million cross the borders after the war which means 1 million were evicted by the Reich.

[Bulldog]

I don't see any problem here. In school I took a holocaust class and was taught holocaust math, and I learned that 6 - 2.5 = 6.

In fact, I learned in holocaust math that no matter what you minus from the number 6 million, the answer is always 6 million.

It's really neat how it works, and it's unlike any other number in the world.

It's magic, just like so many other things associated with the holoco$t.

[Huntinger]

The sick were sent to the Auschwitz Birkenau aka Konzentrationslager Auschwitz complex from various ghettos such as Lomza. Konzentrationslager Auschwitz was suitable because the main camp where the sick and infirm stayed was close to the medical barracks. Due to the high mortality rate of elderly from all over Europe a large number of crematoria were needed; these catered for those who died of typhus, dysentery and other diseases.

Some Lomza juden went to the Kiełbasin Sammellager, south of Grodno, and to Wołkowysk camps as well as to Białystok on the 1st November 1942. The Kielbasis Sammelager is a transit camp; it is claimed der Juden were then sent to Auschwitz.
This is ridiculous as they could have gone with the main group of elderly and sick. Wołkowysk is in the Bialystok district had a high mortality mainly from typhoid fever and starvation. Typhus and dysentery epidemics broke out in the ghetto. By mid-January 1943 only 800 people were alive in the ghetto, 30 percent of them ill with typhus and other diseases. On January 26, 1943 the last 600 yids in the Wołkowysk area were deported to Auschwitz for recovery and medical attention. 80 ghetto inmates who were too feeble to be transported were left to die in a tightly closed bunker within the camp. Of course these are classed as holocaust victims.

The political reason for the Soviets and some Poles to exaggerate the executions of partizani to one of extermination was to rouse the fighting spirit; it is this which started the Warsaw uprising as well as Antyfaszystowska Organizacja Bojowa;
Antyfaszystowska Organizacja Bojowa (Polish for Anti-Fascist Military Organisation), AOB, was an underground organization formed in 1942 in the Ghetto in Białystok by former officers of the Polish Land Forces. It took part in the Białystok Ghetto uprising.

Its tasks included organisation of escape routes for the people incarcerated in the Ghetto as well as gathering arms and equipment for the future fight against the Germans. Since February 1943 it carried over many attacks on German authorities and armed forces operating in the Ghetto. On August 15, 1943, the AOB members started an ill-fated struggle against the liquidation of the Ghetto, which is known as the Białystok Ghetto Uprising.

[Huntinger]

A common theme amongst a hoaxer poster here is asking where did they go, where is the evidence of mass transportations via train. Here is the answer, they walked. Evidence they were sent into what was the Russian Occupied Poland.
Sept 24, 1942. Notice, they are called deportees.



Jüdisch refugees, evicted from the Reich apparently ended up working on Uncle Joes collective farms. While millions of Poles were transported to the Russian Interior under horrendous conditions it seems some had a better life.


Jewish Refugees from Poland Adjust Themselves to Farm Work in Russia
Sept 25, 1942 download pdf
Jewish refugees from Poland now stranded in Russia have adjusted themselves to farm work and are of great help to Russian agriculture replacing able-bodied Russian field workers who are at the front, it was declared here today.

Soviet authorities are very pleased with the work done by a group of Jewish refugees from Warsaw settled on a collective farm on the Volga near Saratov. The group went over the top in delivering its harvest quota and is now engaged in various other branches of collective farm activities. A Jewish tinsmith, Isaac Wasserstraum, despite lameness, is the best tractor driver on the farm, while Shepsel Teitelbaum, a former Warsaw tailor, drives the farm truck carrying grain from the settlement to the city of Saratov, loading and unloading the cargo himself. Isaac Rosenzweig, a Warsaw artisan, and Jacob Schorr, a worker from Sedlitz, are especially singled out for praise in a Saratov paper which reports on the agricultural achievements of the Jewish refugee group.

The women in the group are similarly lauded for their active participation in the work of the farm. The majority of them are now working on the tobacco plantations while others clean the tractors and attend to housekeeping duties. A number of the women have been awarded premiums by the local Soviet authorities in appreciation of their good work.

JEWS EVACUATED FROM THE UKRAINE FIND NEW HOMES IN VOLGA SETTLEMENT
American journalists on a tour this week of villages in the Volga district found that many Jews who were evacuated by the Russian authorities from Kiev, Zhitomir and other Ukrainian cities which are now under Nazi occupation, feel very much at home on the collective farms in the Saratov and Kuibyshev districts where they have been settled. The majority of the Jewish evacuees are women whose husbands are at the front. They are all equal members of the collective settlements in which they live and share the work together with all the others.



Asked how the local villagers treat them, Clara Solomonov, a Jewish evacuee whose husband is in command of a Red Army unit at the front and whose two sons are in the Russian air force, replied: “Just like sisters. We have work, food and a roof over our heads, and feel the same as any of the old settlers.”

The Soviet press today carries an article by Shachno Epstein, general secretary of the Jewish Anti-Fascist Committee, describing how aged Jews are fighting in the ranks of the Russian partisans behind the German lines. He tells the story of a 60-year old Jewish partisan who captured a Nazi armored car and continued to fire from it at the enemy for six days, thus helping the Red Army capture a strategic position. Another aged Jew, Abraham Berzniak, who has three sons in the army, blew up a bridge in the rear of the Rumanian army near Tiraspol, causing the destruction of a German-Rumanian unit together with a Rumanian general. Citing other cases of aged Jews who have distinguished themselves as partisans, the writer states: “These old Jewish fighters together with their sons and grandsons who are fighting on the front lines, are the finest expression of boundless patriotism and devotion to their country. It is no accident that among hundreds of partisans who have recently been decorated by the Government are many Jews. The number of Jewish partisans is constantly growing.”

[Huntinger]

As posted above there is evidence that deportees, mostly Juden walked to their destinations into what was Soviet Occupied Poland and Belarus.

The centre for mass executions was not any AR camp but in the remote Czerwony bor forest; it is likely that Warsaw insurgents, considered to be Bolshevik partizani were sent there for final settlement; this probable action fits in well with the German Military Code that all civilian insurgents are liable to summary execution. It is also in the Zionist interests to fake deaths or to make them as high as possible.

The deportations of Juden to the East amounts to about 1.4 - 1.9 million people; some died, some perhaps to euthanasia operations for terminal illness.

The confusions lies in the desire for Bolsheviks (juden) to demonize their enemy; the Germans desire to keep the final destination of Warsaw Juden secret and the resulting Soviet cover-up and deportations post war.

Post war, about 500 000 juden had the option of returning to Poland or staying in the USSR; Germany would not take these refugees. These people were in the zones known as the RKU and Ostland during the war; the people deep inland were not given that option.

It appears that many of the people deported into the Russian East via the Reinhardt Zoll camps were deported inland to Siberia after being annexed by the Soviets never to be heard of again behind the Iron Curtain. This was to create the illusion that they had been murdered by the Reich.


Wiki reports that population transfer in the Soviet Union was the forced transfer of various groups from the 1930s up to the 1950s ordered by Joseph Stalin. It may be classified into the following broad categories: deportations of "anti-Soviet" categories of population (often classified as "enemies of workers"), deportations of entire nationalities, labor force transfer, and organized migrations in opposite directions to fill the ethnically cleansed territories.

While many Juden died the missing people transported to the Russian East went further East than could be imagined at the behest of the Soviets.
While some who inhabit this forum demand evidence, the evidence of mass deportation is clear; ethnicity may not be important to the Soviets; there is little evidence of the millions who died in their Holodomor and other atrocities, hidden within the fog of history. In comparison to the 66 million the Soviet Juden murdered, the alleged holocaust fades into insignificance.

[been-there]

...this is about Jews who were able to escape... At the moment I am sort of making my way through The Holocaust, by Nora Levin. She also had to admit that Jews fled – were never available to Germans, many from Poland. Her numbers are all over the place, I need to sort them out some day.

I am however interested in what she wrote here (pp.276/77):

“After the amnesty the great majority of released Jews streamed south to Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and other parts of Soviet Central Asia where the climate was milder than in frigid Siberia and where there was some hope of escaping over the Iranian border nearby.
The Mossad (Mossad le Aliyah Bet [Committee for Illegal Immigration]) tracked these movements and established a post in the holy city of Meshed in northeast Iran, close to the Soviet Union. Here were organised a reception centre and an escape route through Kermanshah to Iraq.[10] But few refugees trickled through.
Other Jews succeeded in joining the Polish Army which also offered some hope of leaving the country. The vast majority of the estimated 300,000 Jewish refugees in Soviet Asia remained there exposed to a strange civilisation and a difficult life. Many thousands died of hunger”.

Footnote 10 refers to a book by Jon and David Kimche, The Secret Roads: The “Illegal” Migration of a People, 1938-1948 (London, Secker and Warburg, 1954).

This is interesting, as mentioned, for a further organisation is referred to, the Mossad, helping Jews to go wherever. We know Bricha helped after the war. Do we know how many of these organisations existed and how many Jews made it? No. And surely those who perished while fleeing are also counted as ‘killed by the Nazis’.

The Kimche book is being shipped, I’ll see what it contains and will comment on it.

Regards
Wilf

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