How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

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been-there
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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by been-there »

How could 'THE Holocaust' (whatever that means) not be true?

1936
New York Times, May 31st, 1936, page 14
AMERICANS APPEAL FOR JEWISH REFUGE.
The petition, in expressing the opinion of enlightened Christian leadership in the United States, favoring a larger Jewish immigration into Palestine, stressed the intolerable sufferings of the millions of Jews in "the European holocaust." [...] to save these unfortunate millions from total annihilation [...]
1936
The Jewish Western Bulletin, June 12nd, 1936, page 3
Great Britain has it within her power to throw open the gates of Palestine and let in the victimized and persecuted Jews escaping from the European holocaust.
1936
Chaim Weizmann, The (London) Times, November 26th, 1936
While in Western Europe many individual Jews had happy homes, in Eastern Europe there were 6,000,000 unwanted unfortunates who were condemned to be penned up in places where they could not live. [...] the presence of these 6,000,000 people without a future whose condition was a threat to Europe.
1936
Chaim Weizmann, The Jewish Western Bulletin, December 11th, 1936, page 3
[...] where six million Jews are in a position which is neither life nor death.
1938
New York Times, February 23rd, 1938, page 23
A depressing picture of 6,000,000 Jews in Central Europe deprived of protection or economic opportunities, slowly dying of starvation, all hope gone [...] Now anti-Semitism has spread to thirteen European nations, and threatens the very existence of millions of Jews.
1938
The Jewish Criterion (Pittsburgh), April 1st, 1938, page 15
I shall not comment upon the first except to remind you that six million Jews in Europe are struggling between life and death.
1938
New York Times, May 2nd, 1938
The rising tide of anti-Semitism in Europe today, which has deprived more than 6,000,000 Jews and non-Aryans of a birthright [...]

Etc., etc., etc.
"When people who are honestly mistaken learn the truth,
they either cease being mistaken
or they cease being honest"
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Cerdic
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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

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Are you literally trying to use every DBB on the whole list in order? Now it's the classic "6,000,000 was mentioned before/6,000,000 was Talmudic in origin" crap, which you've spammed from some unnamed website. And as usual you provide no context or commentary on the spam.
in Eastern Europe there were 6,000,000 unwanted unfortunates
What deniers don't mention is that approximately 6,000,000 was the number of Jews who lived in Eastern Europe. Taking that into account, there is nothing sinister about repeated references to 6m East European Jews before the war.
„(...) Wenn wir irgendetwas beim Nationalsozialismus anerkennen, dann ist es die Anerkennung, daß ihm zum ersten Mal in der deutschen Politik die restlose Mobilisierung der menschlichen Dummheit gelungen ist.“ Kurt Schumacher 23. Februar 1932

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Nessie
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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by Nessie »

been-there wrote:How could 'THE Holocaust' (whatever that means) not be true?

1936
New York Times, May 31st, 1936, page 14
AMERICANS APPEAL FOR JEWISH REFUGE.
The petition, in expressing the opinion of enlightened Christian leadership in the United States, favoring a larger Jewish immigration into Palestine, stressed the intolerable sufferings of the millions of Jews in "the European holocaust." [...] to save these unfortunate millions from total annihilation [...]
.........
That is valuable research, but not in the way you think. The common etymology of holocaust is that it was first used in the 1940s in reference to the genocide of the Jews under the Nazis in Europe and it was not until the 1950s it became a a proper name.

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=holocaust

"The Holocaust "Nazi genocide of European Jews in World War II," first recorded 1957, earlier known in Hebrew as Shoah "catastrophe." The word itself was used in English in reference to Hitler's Jewish policies from 1942, but not as a proper name for them."

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/holocaust#Etymology

"Use of the word holocaust to depict Jewish suffering under the Nazis dates back to 1942, according to the OED. By the 1970s, The Holocaust was often synonymous with the Jewish exterminations."

What you have shown is the word was actually first being used in the 1930 to refer to Jewish suffering under Nazi oppression.
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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Statistical Mechanic
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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by Statistical Mechanic »

Cerdic wrote:Are you literally trying to use every DBB on the whole list in order? Now it's the classic "6,000,000 was mentioned before/6,000,000 was Talmudic in origin" crap, which you've spammed from some unnamed website. And as usual you provide no context or commentary on the spam.
in Eastern Europe there were 6,000,000 unwanted unfortunates
What deniers don't mention is that approximately 6,000,000 was the number of Jews who lived in Eastern Europe. Taking that into account, there is nothing sinister about repeated references to 6m East European Jews before the war.
My guess is whale.to.
"the Germans had ample justifiable cause to oppose a minority within their society who worked AGAINST their county's interests" -- been-there, 24 April 2014

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been-there
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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by been-there »

Confessions of A Jewish Holocaust Revisionist: From David Cole to David Stein to David Cole.

Journalist Joshua Blakeney interviewing David Cole, the Jewish Holocaust Revisionist.
"When people who are honestly mistaken learn the truth,
they either cease being mistaken
or they cease being honest"
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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by rollo the ganger »

And we have this from The Jewish Quarterly Review, 1894, Volume VI, page 544 (my highlights):
In 1858, when a calumny was levelled against two Jewish journalists, 147 professors and Christian authors signed a protest in reply, which was published. Amongst the names of the signatories were those of Katkoff, Akaakoff, Menschikoff, Tourgenief, etc. This document was reprinted in the Novosti of November 6th, 1890, but its circulation was forbidden by the public Censor. Another declaration, headed by Count Tolstoi, and which condemned the prevailing persecutions, was published in 1890. This manifesto was likewise prohibited to be circulated by the Censor, and the document only reached the public through its reproduction in a German newspaper.

M. Errc'ra lastly treats of the possible solutions of the Jewish question, which he places under four headings :—

1. Extermination.

2. Baptism, en masse.

3. Emigration.

4. Emancipation and Migration into the Interior of Russia.
http://books.google.com/books?id=slgpAAAAYAAJ

Hmmm? 1858. In Russia and published only by a G-E-R-M-A-N newspaper. Hmmm?

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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by Nessie »

rollo the ganger wrote:And we have this from The Jewish Quarterly Review, 1894, Volume VI, page 544 (my highlights):
In 1858, when a calumny was levelled against two Jewish journalists, 147 professors and Christian authors signed a protest in reply, which was published. Amongst the names of the signatories were those of Katkoff, Akaakoff, Menschikoff, Tourgenief, etc. This document was reprinted in the Novosti of November 6th, 1890, but its circulation was forbidden by the public Censor. Another declaration, headed by Count Tolstoi, and which condemned the prevailing persecutions, was published in 1890. This manifesto was likewise prohibited to be circulated by the Censor, and the document only reached the public through its reproduction in a German newspaper.

M. Errc'ra lastly treats of the possible solutions of the Jewish question, which he places under four headings :—

1. Extermination.

2. Baptism, en masse.

3. Emigration.

4. Emancipation and Migration into the Interior of Russia.
http://books.google.com/books?id=slgpAAAAYAAJ

Hmmm? 1858. In Russia and published only by a G-E-R-M-A-N newspaper. Hmmm?
Indeed, there has been similar through out history and in numerous countries.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_antisemitism

The Crusades - "The People's Crusade that accompanied the first Crusade attacked Jewish communities in Germany, France, and England, and killed many Jews. Entire communities, like those of Treves, Speyer, Worms, Mainz, and Cologne, were murdered by armed mobs. About 12,000 Jews are said to have perished in the Rhineland cities alone between May and July 1096."

France - "The practice of expelling Jews, the confiscation of their property and further ransom for their return was utilized to enrich the French crown during the 13th and 14th centuries. The most notable such expulsions were from Paris by Philip Augustus in 1182, from the whole of France by Louis IX in 1254, by Charles IV in 1306, by Charles V in 1322 and by Charles VI in 1394."

Spain - "The Inquisition used torture to elicit confessions and delivered judgment at public ceremonials known as autos da fe before they gave their victims over to the secular authorities for punishment. Under this dispensation, some 30,000 were condemned to death and executed by being burnt alive."

Portugal - "....a popular riot in 1506 resulted in the deaths of up to four or five thousand Jews, and the execution of the leaders of the riot by King Manuel."

Poland/Lithuania - "During the mid-to-late-17th century the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was devastated by several conflicts, in which the Commonwealth lost over a third of its population (over 3 million people). The decrease of the Jewish population during that period is estimated at 100,000 to 200,000, including emigration, deaths from diseases and captivity in the Ottoman Empire."

What you have found fits in with the history of the Jews going back a very long time.
Consistency and standards in evidencing viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2721#p87772
My actual argument viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2834

Scott - On a side note, this forum is turning into a joke with the vicious attacks--and completely unnecessary vitriol--that everybody is making upon each other.

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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by Statistical Mechanic »

Indeed, and often couched in the same deeply anti-semitic paranoia, using many of the same tropes, as been-there exhibits, with his vague charges, accusations without names and details, and shifting rationale - invoking unproven outrages, mysterious but contradictory and unsubstantiated allegiances, "Jewish intrigue," capitalist exploitation, and whatnot: the justifications for pogroms in Poland and Ukraine in 1919 recorded here, in "A Record Of Pogroms in Poland - Massacres Began in Lemberg, According to Documents Received Here, and Spread over Country," The New York Times June 1, 1919, being a case in point:

“The riot in Przemysl was begun on Nov. 11 . . . The excuse given was that the Jews had shot at the Poles with a machine gun - an accusation for which not the lest proof was offered.”

“It is interesting to not that when a few of the assailants were imprisoned in Lalisz, their wiges gathered before the jail, complaining, ‘First the pay us to beat the Jews, then they put us in jail for the very same thing.’”

“The Gazeta Poranna urged the masses to avenge the crucifixion of Christ and the unwillingness of the powers to cede Danzig to Poland, the latter being declared a Jewish intrigue.”

“The explanation given by the Polish authorities was that the executed men had been Bolsheviki. Subsequent investigations revealed that nearly all of the men had been Zionists and strongly opposed to the Bolshevist movement.”

"While the Jews are suffering in Poland on the pretext that they are Bolsheviki, reports from the Ukraine cabled by Jewish correspondents to this country tell of pogroms perpetrated there because the Jews are anti-Bolshevist."

“In order to incite the base instincts of the Ukrainian armies against the Jews during the first days of the massacres, placards were posted in the Kiev streets, right before the eyes of the authorities, which were signed by the Ukrainian National Republican Military Information Bureau and Cossack Committee, appealing to the Ukrainian population and emphasizing that among Ukraine’s enemies were the Jewish capitalists.”

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-fr ... 8382609EDE

been-there still drinks from this same sewer of anti-semitism.
"the Germans had ample justifiable cause to oppose a minority within their society who worked AGAINST their county's interests" -- been-there, 24 April 2014

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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by theblackrabbitofinlé »

Statistical Mechanic wrote:What deniers don't mention is that approximately 6,000,000 was the number of Jews who lived in Eastern Europe. Taking that into account, there is nothing sinister about repeated references to 6m East European Jews before the war.
Since when has Palestine, Siberia and Turkey been in Eastern Europe?

Image
The Galveston Daily News, April 4th, 1919, page 3

The approximate population of Jews in the Czarist Empire was approx 6,000,000, according to a study published in 1880. But consider yourself formally invited to cite some contemporary sources which back up the HBB that "approximately 6,000,000 was the number of Jews who lived in Eastern Europe."
We just wish to point out to the court that is not a signed sworn statement of Dr. Bender but merely a translation of an alleged or purported statement of Dr. Bender, the original of which, like many other things, is not to be found today.
- Defence counsel, Dachau trial, 7 August 1947

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Re: How could 'THE Holocaust' not be true?

Post by Cerdic »

Did you intend to quote me instead of SM?

The text I quoted referred to Central-Eastern Europe.

If you added up all the Jews in Poland, Galicia (Ukraine), Lithuania, Siberia, Palestine and Turkey back then it would be close to 6m.
„(...) Wenn wir irgendetwas beim Nationalsozialismus anerkennen, dann ist es die Anerkennung, daß ihm zum ersten Mal in der deutschen Politik die restlose Mobilisierung der menschlichen Dummheit gelungen ist.“ Kurt Schumacher 23. Februar 1932

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